[HeartA]

fred, on Jan 4 2005, 02:42 PM, said:

Here is one of my favorite:

Void

AQ108765

You can afford to lose 2 tricks.

Fred Gitelman
Bridge Base Inc.
www.bridgebase.com

Cash Ace first of course. It becomes simple if one of the honors (K, J or 9) drops under Ace. If 3-3, it does not matter how you play.

So let's assume none of the honors appear and the remaining cards are 1-3 distributed (if 0-4, you can do nothing). If all three honors in one hand, you will lose 3 more. Now it becomes clear to play Q at the next round, because it losses only to stiff King while wins against stiff J or 9.

Actually, to play small wins against stiff K or J, and losses against stiff 9. So to play Q or small are equally good.

[fred]

Sorry HeartA, that is not correct.

Fred

[HeartA]

fred, on Jan 4 2005, 03:10 PM, said:

Sorry HeartA, that is not correct.

Fred

Fred,

I added another line before seeing your comments.

[luis]

fred, on Jan 4 2005, 07:42 PM, said:

Here is one of my favorite:

Void

AQ108765

You can afford to lose 2 tricks.

Fred Gitelman
Bridge Base Inc.
www.bridgebase.com

Starting with the Ace seems automatic, if you catch the 9, J or K you make 5 tricks out of 7.
If the Ace collects air I don't think there's a difference between playing the Q, T or even the 5 at the next turn. Seems to be a guess since the 5-1 layouts and the 3-3 layouts are not important after the Ace has been played we only have to care about the 4-2 layouts and then guess what card is doubleton the K, T or 9
Against the Kx and J9xx you win playing low or the T
against Jx and K9xx You win playing the Q or low
against 9x and KJxx you win playing the T or the Q

Is this a position to apply the principle of restricted talent? If they may drop the 9 with 9x or think they have to falsecard with J9xx ?

Mmmmmm

[inquiry]

Ace first has to be right. The next card (Queen, Ten or small) all seem about the same odds to me. So luis is probably right. it has to do with significance of not seeing a false card from four to the nine something. Because from a pure mathematicall standpoint the odds seem the same for all three second choices after the ace.

Ben

[Flame]

what a drama , fred get into the thread and we are all waiting...

[luis]

The question is:
*Assuming defenders can't tell what we have in the trump suit*
Is there a position where the 9 from J9xx or K9xx is a mandatory falsecard?

Since some players may drop the 9 from 9x and some others may think the 9 from J9xx is a falsecard I think that the correct card when the 9 doesn't appear is either the Q or low.
So against weak players I rule out 9x if the 9 doesn't appear and so I play low.
Against a strong players if the 9 doesn't appear I rule out J9xx and so I play the Q next.
Is this crazy? :-)

[fred]

You are close to the right answer, but you are confusing yourselves with all this talk about falsecards. Falsecards don't come into play in this one - if the 9 is dropped from any holding then all of declarer's problems are solved.

This is a pure 3-way guess - the only one I know of in bridge.

Each of the 3 possible plays on the 2nd round (Q, 10, low) loses only to one doubleton (Kx, Jx, 9x). Each of these doubletons is equally likely.

Fred Gitelman
Bridge Base Inc.
www.bridgebase.com

[fred]

Here is another one I like:

J9876

32

You need 2 tricks.

Fred Gitelman
Bridge Base Inc.
www.bridgebase.com

[Stephen Tu]

Quote

Needing four trinck in a suit combination...

K9xx
AJxx

Correct play is king then low to the jack.

Uh .... no it isn't.

Correct play is low to the jack, then the ace. Cashing the K first (the correct maneuver for 4 tricks when the hands are Kxxx, AJ9x) still loses a trick to T87x on the right. low to the J will save you if RHO has the stiff Q.

[HeartA]

Stephen Tu, on Jan 4 2005, 05:03 PM, said:

Quote

Needing four trinck in a suit combination...

K9xx
AJxx

Correct play is king then low to the jack.

Uh .... no it isn't.

Correct play is low to the jack, then the ace. Cashing the K first (the correct maneuver for 4 tricks when the hands are Kxxx, AJ9x) still loses a trick to T87x on the right. low to the J will save you if RHO has the stiff Q.

Stephen is right. That is what I was going to say. But busy in doing fred's question, still missed one

[jahol]

Regarding second case from Fred, I think that any idea about finessing ten is just illusion. With 3-3 distribution of opponents cards, the choice is irrelevant. With 4-2 or 5-1, the only chance is to play RHO for dubleton 10 or singleton 10, respectively.

[jahol]

Yes, that was the point!

[Flame]

Jlall, on Jan 4 2005, 05:30 PM, said:

well its not the ONLY chance, you could play for Tx onside, that is just inferior

Exactly, this is because 10 sgl onside shouldnt be taken into consideration while 10 sgl ofside is

[HeartA]

Quote

You guys need to play against better opponents...

RHO with QT, QTx or stiff Queen will play the queen when you lead low from dummy. It is automatic. So sure, you pick up T876 versus singelton Queen, but you lose to
876 opposite QT,
87 opposite QT6
86 opposite QT7
78 opposite QT8

I wonder, really, which is better odds? hmm... your opponent will have a story to tell for quite some time, thank you very much. I am taking the real percentage play of king then small to the JACK, when needing four tricks.

Ben

I don't understand, Ben. How do I loss in those cases? When Q appears, I cover with Ace, then cash Jack to confirm. When it is 3-2, I don't loss. If RHO shows out, I make the marked finesse.

[inquiry]

HeartA, on Jan 4 2005, 07:17 PM, said:

Quote

You guys need to play against better opponents...

RHO with QT, QTx or stiff Queen will play the queen when you lead low from dummy. It is automatic. So sure, you pick up T876 versus singelton Queen, but you lose to
876 opposite QT,
87 opposite QT6
86 opposite QT7
78 opposite QT8

I wonder, really, which is better odds? hmm... your opponent will have a story to tell for quite some time, thank you very much. I am taking the real percentage play of king then small to the JACK, when needing four tricks.

Ben

I don't understand, Ben. How do I loss in those cases? When Q appears, I cover with Ace, then cash Jack to confirm. When it is 3-2, I don't loss. If RHO shows out, I make the marked finesse.

My bad.. one shouldn't drink on an empty stomack......

[fred]

Congratulations to several of you for working out that with:

J9876

32

You should play low to the J (as this picks up 10x and 10 offside, while low to the 9 picks up 10x onside).

I like this combination because the right play is so counter-intuitive (at least to me).

Your next assignment:

KQ10987

32

You can afford to lose only 1 trick.

This one is harder than the other combinations that have been posted in this thread so far.

Fred Gitelman
Bridge Base Inc.
www.bridgebase.com