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So, what's this?

#1 User is offline   TylerE 

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Posted 2010-March-10, 09:49

(3♦) - X - (4♦) - X?
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#2 User is offline   Free 

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Posted 2010-March-10, 09:49

Bid your longest Major
"It may be rude to leave to go to the bathroom, but it's downright stupid to sit there and piss yourself" - blackshoe
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#3 User is offline   jjbrr 

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Posted 2010-March-10, 10:13

concur
OK
bed
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#4 User is offline   whereagles 

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Posted 2010-March-10, 10:48

it's called responsive double and it means as above ^^
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#5 User is offline   jdonn 

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Posted 2010-March-10, 11:01

You can pass too, as I would on a (43)24 hand for example, or 3325.
Please let me know about any questions or interest or bug reports about GIB.
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#6 User is offline   pooltuna 

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Posted 2010-March-10, 11:07

TylerE, on Mar 10 2010, 10:49 AM, said:

(3♦) - X - (4♦) - X?

this is really, really our hand but I don't have a clear idea of what or how high to bid.
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the Freman, Chani from the move "Dune"

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#7 User is offline   MFA 

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Posted 2010-March-10, 11:20

Just a standard responsive double.
Michael Askgaard
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#8 User is offline   andy_h 

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Posted 2010-March-10, 11:41

Two places to play.
- Andy -

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#9 User is offline   MFA 

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Posted 2010-March-10, 11:46

andy_h, on Mar 10 2010, 07:41 PM, said:

Two places to play.

Hi Andy, nice meeting you in Gold Coast. Unfortunately we didn't have much time to talk (I was busy butchering contracts unfortunately :)).
Michael Askgaard
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#10 User is offline   gnasher 

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Posted 2010-March-10, 12:21

You should bid your lower 4-card or longer major (or pass). That is, with a 5413 shape you should bid 4♥, in case partner is x4x4.
... that would still not be conclusive proof, before someone wants to explain that to me as well as if I was a 5 year-old. - gwnn
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#11 User is offline   TylerE 

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Posted 2010-March-10, 20:09

Ok, just sanity checking..all is well (Except on this board where partner holding 4=4=0=5 passed, playing me for a pen X, which made (8-4 ♦ fit, stiff in all 3 suits between the hands), with our side cold for 7♥, or 6♠
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#12 User is offline   fred 

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Posted 2010-March-10, 20:36

gnasher, on Mar 10 2010, 06:21 PM, said:

You should bid your lower 4-card or longer major (or pass).  That is, with a 5413 shape you should bid 4♥, in case partner is x4x4.

As far as I can tell, this good and important point is not quite part of "expert common knowledge" yet.

Fred Gitelman
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#13 User is offline   MFA 

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Posted 2010-March-10, 21:37

gnasher, on Mar 10 2010, 08:21 PM, said:

You should bid your lower 4-card or longer major (or pass).  That is, with a 5413 shape you should bid 4♥, in case partner is x4x4.

I disagree with that, I think we need to bid spades with that shape. Partner will often have to live with a 4♥-bid on his three-card suit.
Michael Askgaard
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#14 User is offline   jdonn 

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Posted 2010-March-11, 02:54

MFA, on Mar 10 2010, 10:37 PM, said:

gnasher, on Mar 10 2010, 08:21 PM, said:

You should bid your lower 4-card or longer major (or pass).  That is, with a 5413 shape you should bid 4♥, in case partner is x4x4.

I disagree with that, I think we need to bid spades with that shape. Partner will often have to live with a 4♥-bid on his three-card suit.

With what shape? As long as partner understands you would bid 4♥ with that shape I can't picture a shape where he doubles and passes 4♥ with a 3 card suit. 3325, 4333 etc. can all pull to 4♠.
Please let me know about any questions or interest or bug reports about GIB.
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#15 User is offline   aguahombre 

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Posted 2010-March-11, 03:22

ok, so with 3 3 2 5, we cannot play 4 hearts if partner is 4 5 1 3. Partner bids 4 hearts/the resp x, and I must pull in case he has 5 spades and four hearts. Too clever for me.
"Bidding Spades to show spades can work well." (Kenberg)
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#16 User is offline   gwnn 

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Posted 2010-March-11, 03:37

3325 is not 2 places to play.

Well it is since you'd like to play either clubs or diamonds but that can't be arranged. I think with 3325 you either bid 5c or you pass
... and I can prove it with my usual, flawless logic.
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#17 User is offline   aguahombre 

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Posted 2010-March-11, 03:45

gwnn, on Mar 11 2010, 02:37 AM, said:

3325 is not 2 places to play.

Well it is since you'd like to play either clubs or diamonds but that can't be arranged. I think with 3325 you either bid 5c or you pass

right. The responsive double at this level should have 4 in both majors, or 4 in one major and longer clubs.
"Bidding Spades to show spades can work well." (Kenberg)
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#18 User is offline   gnasher 

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Posted 2010-March-11, 06:07

gwnn, on Mar 11 2010, 10:37 AM, said:

3325 is not 2 places to play.

Well it is since you'd like to play either clubs or diamonds but that can't be arranged. I think with 3325 you either bid 5c or you pass

You can also double, but then convert either major to clubs.
... that would still not be conclusive proof, before someone wants to explain that to me as well as if I was a 5 year-old. - gwnn
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#19 User is offline   MFA 

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Posted 2010-March-11, 07:59

jdonn, on Mar 11 2010, 10:54 AM, said:

MFA, on Mar 10 2010, 10:37 PM, said:

gnasher, on Mar 10 2010, 08:21 PM, said:

You should bid your lower 4-card or longer major (or pass).  That is, with a 5413 shape you should bid 4♥, in case partner is x4x4.

I disagree with that, I think we need to bid spades with that shape. Partner will often have to live with a 4♥-bid on his three-card suit.

With what shape? As long as partner understands you would bid 4♥ with that shape I can't picture a shape where he doubles and passes 4♥ with a 3 card suit. 3325, 4333 etc. can all pull to 4♠.

I probably misunderstood your post.

Pull to 4♠ with 3-3 in the majors? :)

I think the initial doubler is expected to pass 4♦X often with normal shapes. We can't indulge ourselves and make a responsive double with 5-5 or some 5-4 in the majors. A responsive double shows less than that. So pulling would often be into a five-card suit.
Michael Askgaard
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#20 User is offline   jdonn 

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Posted 2010-March-11, 13:32

Maybe 3325 was a bad example, but I didn't have a point so much as a question. On what shape with 3 hearts will responder have to double then pass a 4♥ bid?
Please let me know about any questions or interest or bug reports about GIB.
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