gnasher, on Jan 2 2010, 10:51 AM, said:
bluecalm, on Jan 2 2010, 09:52 AM, said:
Would you guys trap with QJ7543 A 984 A53 after 1H opening from partner and 1S overcall from opponents vul against not?
Yes. I don't think that breaches Fred's "never trap Pass with a strong hand" principle, because it's not close to being a strong hand (though it was one before RHO bid spades).
Looking at it another way, if partner happens to pass it out with Kx KJxxx Ax xxxx, we haven't missed anything at all.
Good post. Sorry I haven't so far explained what I mean by this principle yet (and that my original reference to it was so vague).
This is really all about opener, when he holds a weak notrump that is flawed for balancing purposes, not feeling that he MUST reopen with DBL in order to "protect partner in case he has a trap Pass" (because unless partner happens to have a trap Pass and a strong hand, you are likely to be better off not reopening at all with such a hand). By "weak notrump that is flawed for balancing" I mean all hands with 3 or 4 cards in the suit that was overcalled and some hands with 2 cards in that suit (this set of hands is harder to characterize - it becomes a judgment call, but you won't go far wrong if you follow Justin's "it is usually right to pass with Hx and a balanced min imo").
What I mean by a "strong hand" is a hand for which you *know* you have a game opposite a weak notrump. As gnasher points out, after an opponent overcalls 1S, this hand certainly does not qualify.
"Never" doesn't really mean "NEVER" - with some strong hands you simply don't have any choice other than to trap Pass since there is no other sensible call you could make. Note that the more cards you have in the overcaller's suit, the more likely it is that you have a hand like this. That increases the odds of your partner having shortness in their suit and, if he does, that changes the equation as far as his reopening strategy is concerned.
The vulnerability matters. If the opponents are vulnerable and you are not, a trap Pass with a strong hand becomes more attractive - even if partner Passes it out, the undoubled penalty may come close to compensating for your game. If you are vulnerable and the opponents are not, the reverse is obviously true.
IMO making a trap Pass when you have a good fit with partner's suit is almost always a really bad idea regardless of the strength of your hand. In my experience this is another common "mistake" that a lot of decent players make.
From what I have seen, even some liberal trap-Passers reopen with DBL far more often than they should. It is not rare to see some players take this to the extreme by claiming that they ALWAYS (seriously) reopen with DBL. IM(strong)O this is completely unplayable. I suspect you will not be able to find a single top-level player who advocates this strategy.
Fred Gitelman
Bridge Base Inc.
www.bridgebase.com
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Btw, note that Jlall felt *very strongly* about doubling then! 