[maggieb]

Matchpoints
Both Vulnerable

♠ Q98
♥ xx
♦ 98xxx
♣ xxx

(2♥) - x - (4♥) - P
(P) - x - (P) - ?

[H_KARLUK]

"Ab so lu te ly" t/o by Partner in our book.

[gnasher]

I tend to take out my partner's takeout doubles, but on this hand I'd pass and hope they go down. If partner passes 5♦ we aren't going to make it, and playing for 5♦ to be a save is a fairly extreme position.

[paulg]

Double is takeout with extra values.

I have a clear pass. In this position I'd need a sixth diamond to consider bidding.

Paul

[P_Marlowe]

t/o, but there is no law against passing a
t/o double.

The problem is, you have to guess, if your
partner has 4 tricks in his hand, or if a
contract is cheaper.

5 diamonds is a long way to go, 4Hx= will
cost you 790, 5Dx-3 will cost you 800,
take you pick.

With kind regards
Marlowe

[helene_t]

There are 19 total tricks so it's possible that 4♥ and 5♦ goes down. OTOH if either contract goes two down I have to bid.

I think it's close.

[gnasher]

P_Marlowe, on Nov 6 2008, 11:30 AM, said:

5 diamonds is a long way to go, 4Hx= will
cost you 790, 5Dx-3 will cost you 800,
take you pick.

If that's the choice, there probably won't be much difference in matchpoints between the two. It seems more sensible to assume that one action will lead to a good score and one will lead to a bad score.

[OleBerg]

maggieb, on Nov 6 2008, 11:11 AM, said:

Matchpoints
Both Vulnerable

♠ Q98
♥ xx
♦ 98xxx
♣ xxx

(2♥) - x - (4♥) - P
(P) - x - (P) - ?

I would hate this at IMPs, but at MP's I find it a clear-cut pass.

Not only is being wrong not as costly as it would be at IMPs, but partner also needs a few less excuses to double on an off-shape and /or borderline hand.

[655321]

Pass.

Yes partner's double is takeout, but with such a flat hand passing is the normal action. You hope that 4♥ goes down. Often it won't, but 5♦ will make much less often.

[pclayton]

Pass. No I don't like it much. Why does partner bid so much when I have such a lousy hand?

[Edmunte1]

Yes, still take-out, showing extras (17+ with singleton ♥, 20+ with dblt), and yes i'll pass with this balanced hand

[jtfanclub]

I hate that these are called takeout, when you know partner won't 'take out' with a balanced nothing. If after

2♥ X P

you always passed with this sort of hand, would you still describe your partner's call as a takeout double?

I agree with the field on what the double looks like and that I would pass, but I hate using the same description for both doubles.

[helene_t]

The thing is, when responding to a double of a 1♥ opening or a double of a 6♥ opening, in both cases you play p for appr. 4144. So it makes sense that the same term is used for both doubles. Of course, the higher the level the less trumps you need to convert it.

[P_Marlowe]

It is not clear, if the 2nd X is based on a hand with
a t/o shape.
It could well be, that partner happens to have a
balanced power house, I dont know.
If he is balanced, he will have lots of add. strength,
if not, he could be slightly weaker.

With kind regards
Marlowe

[jtfanclub]

helene_t, on Nov 6 2008, 11:45 AM, said:

The thing is, when responding to a double of a 1♥ opening or a double of a 6♥ opening, in both cases you play p for appr. 4144. So it makes sense that the same term is used for both doubles. Of course, the higher the level the less trumps you need to convert it.

But in this case, you aren't really showing anything about shape with the second X, are you?

You doubled the first time, which showed appr. 4144. You don't need a second double to say "I still have the same 13 cards I had the previous round of bidding". I don't see how the second X has anything to do with shape. It's just tricks.

[neilkaz]

I also pass and hope PD can set it since I expect either 5♦ or 4♠ to be a bloodbath.

[peachy]

It is a takeout double repeated. I will Pass because the likelihood we make 5D is slim to nil while the likelihood that 4HX goes down is better. If it makes, we get minus 790 instead of minus 800 (or more).