[EricK]

Is this just another example of partner trying to get the blame in first?

Since 3♦ is a stronger bid than 2♠ and partner already overbid despite hearing only 2♠, I can't see why your bidding 3♦ would have led to a better contract.

[TimG]

EricK, on Jul 20 2007, 11:51 AM, said:

Is this just another example of partner trying to get the blame in first?

Since 3♦ is a stronger bid than 2♠ and partner already overbid despite hearing only 2♠, I can't see why your bidding 3♦ would have led to a better contract.

I think because responder felt that opener's 2♠ rebid promised six spades. Not that I agree, but I expect that was the point.

[pbleighton]

There's been a lot of speculation on what 2S and 3D promise, or don't, including by me.

Wayne, what system were you playing?

Does 2S promise 6?

Does 3D promise extras?

Peter

[sceptic]

bid_em_up, on Jul 20 2007, 02:27 PM, said:

The_Hog, on Jul 20 2007, 09:07 AM, said:

Wayne, you have a very easy comeback to your "partner's" comment: "You are an idiot." Your bidding was impeccable.

For once, I agree with The_Hog.

The trouble with that Ron, is usually, I am the idiot LOL

[sceptic]

I was playing sayc (I think ) pick up pard as usual (advanced)

[ArtK78]

If you are playing 2/1 game forcing, then opener should rebid 3D. You are already in a game forcing auction, so 3D does not show extras - it just shows shape. Similarly, 2S would show 6 spades, as there is no need to distort one's pattern when one is in a game forcing auction.

Responder should bid 3S. 3S says that spades is trump and that we may have something more than game on this hand. 4S is weaker (fast-arrival) and says that you have a heart suit, at least 3 spades and minimal game forcing values.

4NT was a wild stab in the dark, and was not justified on the hand or the auction.

The foregoing represents typical partnership agreements when playing 2/1 game forcing. Some players play picture bids, and the jump to 4S would not be weak - it would be showing a hand with strong hearts and spades. And some partnerships would not permit a 3D bid without extras even though you are in a game forcing auction - a holdover from old-fashioned Standard American (1S-2H-3D is a "high reverse").

[skjaeran]

ArtK78, on Jul 20 2007, 10:27 PM, said:

If you are playing 2/1 game forcing, then opener should rebid 3D. You are already in a game forcing auction, so 3D does not show extras - it just shows shape. Similarly, 2S would show 6 spades, as there is no need to distort one's pattern when one is in a game forcing auction.

That's a question regarding agreements, and doesn't follow directly from using 2/1.

I, for one, disagree. I still want to keep reverses and "high reverses" for showing extra strenght in 2/1 sequences. Thus I'd rebid 2♠ on the thread hand.

[kenberg]

Playing SAYC, as I understand it, 1S-2H-2S-3S is not passable so if responder wants to explore for slam he could start that way. Same if playing 2/1. But should he do this? 1S-2H-2S-4S in SAYC or 2/1 should show spade support (three, not usually four), a heart suit, and nothing else. Seems that is what he has. A blast to 4N is, as most everyone has said, hopelessly brash.


Now as to whether you should or should not bid 3D over 2H. This can be debated forever and you can find very very good players on either side of the issue. Anyone who calls himself advanced should be aware of the fact that there is disagreement here. If he wants to say "I always have six when I rebid my major" he is free to play that way and he can find expert support for it (Marty Bergen, for example). But he just shows his own ignorance if he maintains that this is the only way bridge is played. My own preference (quoting me will get you nowhere) is to rebid 2S with your hand whether 2D was or was not game forcing. When I rebid 3D over 2H, I have more. I can also find expert support for this view (Mike Lawrence, for example). I believe the majority see it my way (and your way and Lawrence's way), but I cannot prove this.

[helene_t]

In SAYC 3♦ promises 16 HCP. Your p doesnt know SAYC and besides he's resulting. I estimate that this 5♠ is one of the best 5♠ he ever bid.

[Free]

3♦ would show a stronger hand, 2♠ is fine. P is a noob, he bids his Blacky without knowing anything about minor suit controls... He might as well have bid 4NT right away to hide his ♥s.