[Echognome]

cherdano, on Jul 7 2005, 01:32 PM, said:

Hmm, those of you who say you would open this with a weak opening bid showing majors, are you talking of some Ekren showing 4+/4+? I never got it how people can be happy to open this with 4-4, 5-4, 6-4 or 6-6...

I would either open this 2♠, then later bid 3♥ voluntarily, or pass and bid Michaels later.

Arend

I would open this an Ekren 2♣ in our system showing 4/4 or better and be happy about it.

If there is no competition, we have easy methods to find out about the extra shape.

If there is competition, the opening hand is allowed to double (if at a reasonable level) to show that they had freak shape (65 or better). It hasn't been a problem for us thus far.

[dogsbreath]

hi
...those of a sensitive nature ..turn away now..

Flannery ..

Rgds Dog

[bearmum]

Pass

[keylime]

eek, even with ZAR this isn't good.

[Gerben42]

EEK! He said the F-word!

Sorry but it is not part of your system. And fwiw the hand doesn't fit the description either.

[helene_t]

As for the TD's possible ruling, opening this 1♠ is not a psyche, of course. If you want to psyche, open something absurd like 3♣ or 1NT.

In the Netherlands, you're not allowed to have the agreement to open with less than 8 HCPs. In general, if you open with less than 8 HCPs, most TDs will apply inverted burden of proof. But in this case, you'll probably get away with it since you're not expected to have specific agreements about 6610-shapes.

[ochinko]

The_Hog, on Jul 7 2005, 03:17 PM, said:

Pass and come in later.

P-(1D)-P-
RHO now bids 3Sp(splinter), or 4NT(bw), or even 5D. How do you come in?

[cherdano]

ochinko, on Jul 8 2005, 11:17 AM, said:

The_Hog, on Jul 7 2005, 03:17 PM, said:

Pass and come in later.

P-(1D)-P-
RHO now bids 3Sp(splinter), or 4NT(bw), or even 5D. How do you come in?

I don't. I hope they play 6♦ and go down after club lead ruffed, ♥A, or even in 5♦ just because of the bad suit breaks (without warning).

Arend

[MickyB]

ochinko, on Jul 8 2005, 11:17 AM, said:

The_Hog, on Jul 7 2005, 03:17 PM, said:

Pass and come in later.

P-(1D)-P-
RHO now bids 3Sp(splinter), or 4NT(bw), or even 5D. How do you come in?

Over 3♠ or 4NT, I'll cuebid diamonds.

Over 5♦...yuck! Good thing he isn't too likely to bid that

If I had Ekren available (which I'd rather not) then I guess I'd probably use it...whatever you do, you are planning on showing your shape with another bid later, at least if you open Ekren pard will definitely know your suits. OTOH if he has a strong hand you may land up guessing far more than if you had passed...ok I've just convinced myself to pass

[ochinko]

cherdano, on Jul 8 2005, 01:21 PM, said:

ochinko, on Jul 8 2005, 11:17 AM, said:

The_Hog, on Jul 7 2005, 03:17 PM, said:

Pass and come in later.

P-(1D)-P-
RHO now bids 3Sp(splinter), or 4NT(bw), or even 5D. How do you come in?

I don't. I hope they play 6♦ and go down after club lead ruffed, ♥A, or even in 5♦ just because of the bad suit breaks (without warning).

Arend

I agree, better not appear at all in this case. The thing is that passing the first time is a gamble too. What if the bidding goes:

P-(1C)-P-(1Sp)
P-(1NT)-P-3NT

Will partner be able to find a good lead? Opps could have a cold game, when we have a cold game in either major.

Petko

[Echognome]

MickyB, on Jul 8 2005, 12:05 PM, said:

If I had Ekren available (which I'd rather not) then I guess I'd probably use it...whatever you do, you are planning on showing your shape with another bid later, at least if you open Ekren pard will definitely know your suits. OTOH if he has a strong hand you may land up guessing far more than if you had passed...ok I've just convinced myself to pass

I don't understand this. So if you pass partner will know later what you have and you won't be guessing? Partner puts you on a 66 passing first? Yes there are some auctions where if you pass and come in later, partner may put you on a 55, but he won't know exactly how weak or strong or distributional you are.

[tysen2k]

1♠. This auction is going to be competitive. It's always to your advantage to describe your hand as quickly as possible in competitive auctions. First-mover advantage. Pass does not describe your hand well.

Tysen

[Double !]

I used to be able to open this hand 2 diamonds 5-5 or better in majors, 4-10hcp but was told it's forbidden by the great acbl, but I can open 2H to show the same thing.

without my toy, i guess I'll open 1 spade and let the opps start competing at the 2-level if they so desire.
I'd rather get in the first shot versus being on the defensive and giving the opps the first shot. 5 losers, & I'll let Ben count the zars.

[pork rind]

amazing how many consider this a weak hand. for the record i opened 1s, rho bid 2d, part bid 2s, lho passed and i bid 4s ppp. making 4
could have been a complete misfit. so what. it would not be the first time. i see this as a pretty powerful hand. when i see openings on 4333 etc with 10 or 11 i am amazed that some would not open this hand. as for the acbl ruling against you for opening this lolllllll what a joke

[mike777]

pork rind, on Jul 8 2005, 11:10 PM, said:

amazing how many consider this a weak hand. for the record i opened 1s, rho bid 2d, part bid 2s, lho passed and i bid 4s ppp. making 4
could have been a complete misfit. so what. it would not be the first time. i see this as a pretty powerful hand. when i see openings on 4333 etc with 10 or 11 i am amazed that some would not open this hand. as for the acbl ruling against you for opening this lolllllll what a joke

LOl, we are all forcing to 4 level one way or other; you miss the point of many of the posters. I open very junky and you can debate if this is one bid or not.

Agree opening on 4333 with 10hcp and some 11hcp is pretty amazing and I love to open junky.

[Elianna]

pork rind, on Jul 8 2005, 09:10 PM, said:

as for the acbl ruling against you for opening this lolllllll

Never said that the aCBL would rule against you for opening this. Just for having an AGREEMENT to open weak hands. There is a difference.