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Pre-empts 4th on bid all pass to you What criteria do you apply

Poll: Pre-empts 4th on bid all pass to you (23 member(s) have cast votes)

Pre-empts 4th on bid all pass to you

  1. 1 Hearts (12 votes [52.17%])

    Percentage of vote: 52.17%

  2. 4 Hearts (6 votes [26.09%])

    Percentage of vote: 26.09%

  3. Other (5 votes [21.74%])

    Percentage of vote: 21.74%

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#1 User is offline   badderzboy 

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Posted 2005-June-14, 07:09

Scoring: MP


Holding this hand what do u bid?

What would the hand need to look like to open 4♥ or systemic equivalent

Steve
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#2 User is offline   inquiry 

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Posted 2005-June-14, 07:13

Well, not four hearts, as all you need from partner is a couple hearts, spade ace and diamond king for a laydown slam. This hand is even too strong for namyats. The way I play, I would open it 2♣ but many will not be able to do this, so 1♥ is fine.
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#3 User is offline   ochinko 

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Posted 2005-June-14, 07:28

badderzboy, on Jun 14 2005, 08:09 AM, said:

Dealer: West
Vul: N/S
Scoring: MP
♠ K4
♥ AKJ107432
♦ A2
♣ J
 


Holding this hand what do u bid?

What would the hand need to look like to open 4♥ or systemic equivalent

Steve

1H will miss a game if all pass, 4H might miss a slam. Tough decision.

To automatically open 4H my DA should be replaced with a small diamond.

Wait a minute, this is not bridge, these are matchpoints. 3NT for me :) (I assume I don't play gambling NT.)

Petko
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#4 User is offline   mr1303 

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Posted 2005-June-14, 07:30

Looks like a fairly reasonable NAMYATS hand to me. 4C.

I'm an idiot. Just realised we're in 4th seat. So 4H is fine, I doubt we'll have a slam if partner couldn't open.
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#5 User is offline   P_Marlowe 

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Posted 2005-June-14, 07:41

Hi,

1H, planning to rebid 3H.

I wont quarrel with 4H, especially if it is late in the tournament
and I am your partner, because chances are high, I'm tired.

4H has the adv. that it finishes the auction very fast and you always
reach game, 1H has the adv. that you may stop below game and go
plus.

With kind regards
Marlowe
With kind regards
Uwe Gebhardt (P_Marlowe)
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#6 User is offline   joker_gib 

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Posted 2005-June-14, 07:50

A lot of hands produce 10 tricks (Difficult for partner to judge that with ♠Q and 2 small ♥ I have a game !) and as Ben says partner can still have enough for slam. Reason why I don't open that with 4♥ or Namyats


So I will open that game forcing in ♥

Alain
Alain
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#7 Guest_Jlall_*

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Posted 2005-June-14, 07:59

ochinko, on Jun 14 2005, 08:28 AM, said:

1H will miss a game if all pass

I guarantee you can simulate 10,000 hands and not one will have 1H go all pass when you hold this. You have 8 hearts and only 16 points, somebody will bid.

I just start with 1H planning to jump to 4H next. Way too strong for a 4H opener.

Quote

Just realised we're in 4th seat.


I don't see where it says that unless you are assuming we are south.
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#8 User is offline   inquiry 

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Posted 2005-June-14, 08:03

Jlall, on Jun 14 2005, 09:59 AM, said:

Quote

Just realised we're in 4th seat.


I don't see where it says that unless you are assuming we are south.

It says it in the title to the post
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#9 User is offline   Blofeld 

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  Posted 2005-June-14, 08:03

Justin, it's in the thread title: "all pass to you".

I don't like 4♥ as there's too much chance of missing a slam. I'll start with a strong artificial bid if I can, or 1♥ otherwise.
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#10 Guest_Jlall_*

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Posted 2005-June-14, 08:10

ok thanks :) I knew I had probably missed it just did not see it. Much better problem now. If I open 4H I still risk missing slam obviously. But if I open 1H I risk letting them in with a spade overcall and them finding a cheap save and forcing me to guess at the 5 level. Brutal. I dont see getting to slam very often opposite the magic hands (no club wastage) even if I do open 1h (maybe 2C is best afterall) so I would just try 4H and apologize to partner if this is wrong.
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#11 User is offline   Free 

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Posted 2005-June-14, 09:12

For me, 4♥ in 4th seat is 10 tricks with ♥, no void, so I'll bid that. I don't know who plays namyats in 3rd or 4th seat, but it seems quite useless...
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#12 User is offline   Double ! 

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Posted 2005-June-14, 14:16

LOL
now I know that I am experiencing cognitive deterioration because I open that hand 2 clubs. I know that most will disagree but, when I have game in my hand or would be VERY unhappy if I opened with a 1-bid and wound up playing there (unlikely given this distribution- granted), I open 2C. Too many outside controls for 4H or stayman backwards.
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#13 User is offline   Elianna 

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Posted 2005-June-14, 14:22

Double !, on Jun 14 2005, 01:16 PM, said:

LOL
now I know that I am experiencing cognitive deterioration because I open that hand 2 clubs. I know that most will disagree but, when I have game in my hand or would be VERY unhappy if I opened with a 1-bid and wound up playing there (unlikely given this distribution- granted), I open 2C. Too many outside controls for 4H or stayman backwards.

And boy, would you be unhappy if pard passed 2c. ;) (Just referring to another thread in this forum.)
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#14 User is offline   the hog 

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Posted 2005-June-14, 17:36

As partner would pass:
Axxx
xx
Kxxx
xxx
and this makes me virtually cold for 6, I won't open 4H or Namyats. I normally don't like to open 2C on this hand type, but in 4th seat I think there is less chance of the opponents pre empting, and more chance of me getting useful information from partner.
So 2C for me.
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#15 User is offline   Fluffy 

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Posted 2005-June-14, 18:19

1♥ to me, but considering we are in 4th, if my system has loads of relays, a 2♣ opening could work.
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#16 User is offline   Winstonm 

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Posted 2005-June-14, 19:24

NAMYATS for me in all seats. My partnership definition is 4 losers. Partner knows to look only at control cards. I think NAMYATS is more valuable here than in an earlier seat as it defines the playing strength without inferring greated high cards.

WinstonM

Of course I sympathize with Justin; his partners never pass so he is never faced with this problem, LoL.
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#17 User is offline   Gerben42 

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Posted 2005-June-15, 04:07

This hand is a bit strong for Namyats as Ben already mentioned but you are in 4th seat which means that the requirements for all the "preemptive" bids go up. So Namyats for me, showing something like the actual hand in 4th seat.
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#18 User is offline   pclayton 

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Posted 2005-June-15, 09:30

Looks to me as this is one of my 2♣ openers (close to 2♦ - which is the real moose). French Standard handles this hand easily, as does Ben's system.
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#19 User is offline   PriorKnowledge 

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Posted 2005-June-15, 10:33

2C for me. 4-loser and enough high cards that it might go 1H all pass. I think a little strong for Namyats. My preferred Namyats method usually includes a 2-loser suit. Change the hand to ♠xx and it is perfect Namyats.

2nd choice is 1H.

4H is definitely out. Much too strong.
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