[pbleighton]

A partner has suggested to me that we incorporate Namyats into the Precision system we are using.

I am not entirely averse, but feel that Namyats is less useful in a strong club system than in standard bidding, because you can always open the "strong" 4M bids 1C, whereas they aren't always strong enough for 2C.

It does let the opps find their fit, however.

I like 4m as natural, too.

What do you think?

Peter

[Dean]

I played Romex Namyats for a while but dropped it in favour of preempts.

Especially at pairs white vs red open 4m on 64 hands is just too usefull.

Teams I might reconsider.

Dean

[the hog]

Peter this is an interesting question, because as you mention you can open 1C and rebid 2/3/4 M

If you play Namyats in a big C system, I would suggest it should be very specific so that pd will know exactly what to do. I played
4C = AKQ to 7 in either M and an outside A
4D = AQJ or AKJ to 7 and an outside A

The problem is one of frequency - is it worth incorporating these and losing the valuable 4m pre empts?

[pclayton]

Namyats might be more important playing a strong club - since (the way I play my Namyats anyway), just about all hands that qualify arent strong enough for a strong club anyway.

Playing a strong club, partner will frequently pass semi-balanced 6-7 counts with tolerance for opener's major. These are exactly the kind of hands that make game cold opposite a namyats opener.

[Gerben42]

Losing the 4m-preempts might be not so big when you give up on the gambling 3NT, master of wrongsidedness (and never comes up).

Normally one plays 3NT = a 4m-preempt (usually without interest in playing 3NT).

Has anyone tried the alternative? 3NT = Any Namyats hand. This might be interesting.

[Chamaco]

Gerben42, on Apr 4 2005, 09:25 AM, said:

Losing the 4m-preempts might be not so big when you give up on the gambling 3NT, master of wrongsidedness (and never comes up).

Normally one plays 3NT = a 4m-preempt (usually without interest in playing 3NT).

The inability by pard to raise immediately your minor is certainly quite a price to pay. If pard can raise immediately, it is BY FAR tougher for opps, rather than having 1 free round of bidding.

Otherwise, an effective scheme vs 3NT broken minor is:

X = strong with both majors.
4C = good hand (often slammish) with H, pard will relay with 4D if slam interest
4D = good hand (often slammish) with S, pard will relay with 4H if slam interest
4H/S = good hand single suited, not slammish


As one can see, the immediate 4m preempt (especially diamonds), consumes 2 precious steps for opps slam bidding.

So I guess all this boils down to how often one uses Namyats vs a minor preempt, which in turns relates to how relaxed are the criteria to open a Namyats.

Quote

Has anyone tried the alternative? 3NT = Any Namyats hand. This might be interesting.

Yes there are player who do that routinely.
Not sure whether it is a winner, though: it increases the frequency of occurrence of a bid which wrongsides 3NT, as well as selfpreempting our side when we hold a major.
However, if quite a few strong players use it, there must be a reason

[pclayton]

Gerben42, on Apr 4 2005, 01:25 AM, said:

Losing the 4m-preempts might be not so big when you give up on the gambling 3NT, master of wrongsidedness (and never comes up).

Normally one plays 3NT = a 4m-preempt (usually without interest in playing 3NT).

Has anyone tried the alternative? 3NT = Any Namyats hand. This might be interesting.

Yep I use it; its only come up once though.

OTOH, the 4-of-a-minor preempt has come up several times though.

Only neutral results so far.

[Free]

I play strong ♣ with namyats and 3NT as 4-level preempt in a minor. With gambling hands, imo it's better to open constructive. Namyats helps if it's well defined: exact number of losers, small range of tophonours, no voids,... This way we once found a laydown 7♠, where most other pairs didn't even reach small slam.

[csdenmark]

Gerben42, on Apr 4 2005, 11:25 AM, said:

Has anyone tried the alternative? 3NT = Any Namyats hand. This might be interesting.

Neapolitan Club acc. to Edgar Kaplan 'The complete italian system of winning bridge', page 72.

Quote

The preemptive bid that shows a solid or semi-solid suit is 2NT(all strong hands are opened 1♣). To open 2 No Trump, you must have a 7+ card diamond, heart or spade suit headed by the Ace-King or by the Ace-Queen-Jack, with no side honors.

The forcing bid is 3 ♣ over which opener completes the picture and responder places the contract.

Tend to avoid 2NT for diamonds as an NT-contract will play from wrong side.

3♣ opening is something in between standard preempt and the above description, something like Precision 3♣(Belladonna/Garozzo).

-------------------------------
For those interested:

Namyats is a part of Precision/SUPERprecision(Belladonna/Garozzo), Viking Precision, Icelandic Precision, Power Precision(Sontag/Weichsel), Cohen/Berkowitz, Roman Club and Arno Club.

Namyats is NOT a part of Blue Club, Orange Club, Meckwell Club or Hamway Club.

[keylime]

I don't use it myself - I put it at the one M or the one club slot due to the controls of the hand.

I though enjoy bidding four of a minor just to be a punk.

[Flame]

Namyats has more need in a strong club system, if i had a choice between sayc 1M and strong club 1C with a Namyays hand i would definetly prefer the 1M, and since those hands are too strong for strong clubs systems 1M, the Namyats has more value to the strong club systems.
Unlike the hog said i think you should open namyats in precision more times then in sayc, since you just have no bid. Last week i held AX AQJXXXX AX XX non vul vs vul
definetly not a classic namyats, but the alternatives seemed worse, so i opened 4C. not saying you should go that far, just giving an example to a hand with no better alternative in a precision like system.

[Rebound]

Flame, on Apr 9 2005, 03:59 AM, said:

Namyats has more need in a strong club system, if i had a choice between sayc 1M and strong club 1C with a Namyays hand i would definetly prefer the 1M, and since those hands are too strong for strong clubs systems 1M, the Namyats has more value to the strong club systems.
Unlike the hog said i think you should open namyats in precision more times then in sayc, since you just have no bid. Last week i held AX AQJXXXX AX XX non vul vs vul
definetly not a classic namyats, but the alternatives seemed worse, so i opened 4C. not saying you should go that far, just giving an example to a hand with no better alternative in a precision like system.

I think I would lie by a J and open that hand 1 club.

I am starting to like the idea of 3NT as any namyats hand... but in any case, ours is currently narrowly defined as an 8-card suit headed by at least AKQ and at most a king outside the suit. I grant that it comes up infrequently, but when it does, partner can accurately set the level of the contract by just counting the number of top tricks in his hand. I question its value as-is because it is so rare, however. There's the rub - is it worth it to play namyats in such a way as to practicaly guarantee a good result but only once in however many - 2 thousand hands?

No plans to change it anytime soon, but this thread has been food for thought.