[diana_eva]

All white, IMPs, team match on BBO:

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Maybe I had a brain dead moment here, but... what would you do?

[shyams]

4♠

[BillPatch]

4♠

[mgoetze]

Hm, does 4♥ promise a spade fit and ask for a heart lead against their 5♦ sac? I guess not since we're an unpassed hand, so that leaves me with no other option but 4♠.

[apollo1201]

Aren't you leading against 5D?

Anyway, I'm bidding 4S as well, I'm too weak to handle all the bad things that can happen after a (TO)X of 4D.

[neilkaz]

4♠ maybe it makes, maybe they take a phantom sac in 5♦.

[rmnka447]

4 ♠, supporting with support. Despite the square distribution, you certainly have a decent raise closer to a 2 1/2 raise where you'd jump raise after a forcing NT than a direct simple 2 ♠ raise.

If double is penalty, you can't know if partner has any ♦. Also, with ♠ honors, you defensive potential is reduced because it isn't likely you'll take many ♠ tricks. Since you can't know if 4 ♦ can be beat, you shouldn't double lest you give away a game swing.

If a double is negative, there's a problem if partner bids ♣s. You have to guess whether to sit and find partner with 4 ♣, or, bid 5 ♠ and find you're 1 level too high. Even if partner has 4 ♥s, there's no guarantee it will play better than 4 ♠.

If you pass, partner may find it difficult to reopen. If partner does reopen with a double, you're back to same problem as with a direct penalty double. If partner doesn't have a hand to double, the hand will probably be passed out unless partner has some very distributional hand. 4 ♠ may make with a lot of hands where partner can't reopen. So passing risks giving away a ♠ game swing on a decent number of hands.

So 4 ♠ is the right bid any time it makes. If it goes down, you certainly have a game good explanation in the post mortem -- you had a tough decision and pushed a little to avoid losing a potential game swing. As someone suggested, by making an immediate game raise, you may push to opponents into a phantom sac that you can now double because the worry of creating a game swing has been removed.

[diana_eva]

Thanks all. I passed and hoped partner will reopen with X which I would then pass. Except partner didn't reopen and we lost game. Other table bid and made 4♠.

Not sure why I felt so strongly pass and punish was right. It would have been, they went down 3 in 4♦.

[gszes]

Preempts work sometimes. here it forces us into a slight

4s

overbid. If p is short in dia 4s should be just fine (barring a really bad trump split. It would seem like x would be a good idea but it runs the risk of us bypassing 4s and ending up in 5c so too much risk when game is the limit unless p has significant extra values.

[quiddity]

Pass and punish seems strange to me but I can understand pass and bid 4♠ if partner reopens.

[jogs]

I wouldn't feel guilty about passing this hand. Unrealistic to expect partner to reopen with a double. Especially if you had a minor break in tempo. Most would rebid 4♠ rather than pass for penalties.
If RHO had bid 3♦, you would have a clear 3♠ call. Would partner go to 4?

[jogs]

Maybe it's time for negative doubles to only apply after a minor suit opening. Then after major suit opening the double should show this type of hand. Opener should never rebid 5♣ unless he has lots of shape. We want to compete to 4♠, but not 5♠.

[yunling]

Versus sound preempts, 4♠ is much better than pass or double since partner is likely to be short in diamonds thus nothing is wasted.
Less so if they preempt aggressively but I'm still bidding 4♠. You don't really have much to gain with a double here, since your diamonds are a bit too long so very unlikely for pard to pass for penalty.

[KurtGodel]

diana_eva, on 2015-September-18, 22:16, said:

Thanks all. I passed and hoped partner will reopen with X which I would then pass. Except partner didn't reopen and we lost game. Other table bid and made 4♠.

Not sure why I felt so strongly pass and punish was right. It would have been, they went down 3 in 4♦.

What tricks did you think you were taking in diamonds?