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Out of Order?

#1 User is offline   Adam1105 

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Posted 2015-June-25, 01:50



I liked my 2S bid as opener's LHO. Opener told me it was "out of order." I admit my spades weren't THAT great, but I liked it as a defensive bid and if my p can find a fit, who knows. Was I, playing sayc, making an inappropriate bid?
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#2 User is offline   dave251164 

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Posted 2015-June-25, 02:45

You would usually expect to have a 6 card suit and 5-10 hcp, which you have albeit in soft values (Qs, J's) and not in your trump suit. It's meant as a disruptive bid and you tend to find that you get the most "out of order" type comments when it has successfully worked and kept the opponents out of their optimum contract, which could be game or even a slam. Opponents have no right to make such comments -if they have a problem with your bids they should just call the Director - and they are often made out of disgruntlement that you stopped them bidding their hands to best effect or even just because they wouldn't have made the bid in their so called style/methods/agreements. Either call the Director to deal with THEIR inappropriate comments or if they were really nasty about it, you could always respond with something like "It may or may not have been out of order, but it was clearly VERY effective!" That way you win the psychological war and they'll be so annoyed that they'll probably screw up the next board/s, gifting you top/s too!
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#3 User is offline   gwnn 

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Posted 2015-June-25, 02:53

It's not an illegal bid but you're doing your results a disservice by making it. I guess this time it worked but your opp instead of going all Phil Hellmuth should have just silently rubbed his palms, waiting for the Day of Reckoning.

Edit: I'd bid 1S instead.
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#4 User is offline   cherdano 

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Posted 2015-June-25, 02:54

I wouldn't bid 2, but it's closer to being the correct call than to being "Out of order".
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#5 User is offline   gwnn 

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Posted 2015-June-25, 03:08

View Postcherdano, on 2015-June-25, 02:54, said:

I wouldn't bid 2, but it's closer to being the correct call than to being "Out of order".

I think it's about 70% out of order and 30% the correct call, but YMM obviously V. I definitely think it's 100% out of order to say it's out of order at the bridge table.
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#6 User is offline   blackshoe 

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Posted 2015-June-25, 06:36

Personally, if an opponent simply commented "that bid is out of order", I'd just ignore him. If he took it further, then I'd call the director. I would not respond in kind, however nasty he gets. Two wrongs don't make a right. I know this because the ACBL's Zero Tolerance policy says so. B-)
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#7 User is offline   gordontd 

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Posted 2015-June-25, 06:55

View Postblackshoe, on 2015-June-25, 06:36, said:

Personally, if an opponent simply commented "that bid is out of order", I'd just ignore him.

"No, it came immediately after the one on my right".
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#8 User is offline   nige1 

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Posted 2015-June-25, 09:08

View PostAdam1105, on 2015-June-25, 01:50, said:


I liked my 2S bid as opener's LHO.
Opener told me it was "out of order."
I admit my spades weren't THAT great,
but I liked it as a defensive
and if my p can find a fit, who knows.
Was I, playing sayc, making an inappropriate bid?
IMO 1 = 10. Pass = 9. 2 = 8. All close and It depends on your agreements but for most partnerships, a two-bid, in second seat, at amber, shows a better suit. If you do overcall 2, Zia might approve when opponents declare and misguess the plain suits.
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#9 User is offline   gwnn 

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Posted 2015-June-25, 09:32

Posted Image

(someone had to do it)
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#10 User is offline   gszes 

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Posted 2015-June-25, 10:47

View Postgwnn, on 2015-June-25, 03:08, said:

I think it's about 70% out of order and 30% the correct call, but YMM obviously V. I definitely think it's 100% out of order to say it's out of order at the bridge table.


YMM obviously V sorry but I cannot figure that out, can you please clarify?
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#11 User is offline   gszes 

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Posted 2015-June-25, 10:51

Sour grapes is quite common unfortunately. No one likes being "fixed" and it is mainly because no one like bad luck and you just happened to be at "their" table when you chose to bid 2s. Do not be concerned with these rants BUT any time you hear a comment like that it may be best to ask? Should we call the director in case you were injured? Normally that will not only shut up the "bullies" but will earn you a reputation as one that wants to play fair:)
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#12 User is offline   ArtK78 

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Posted 2015-June-25, 12:59

View Postgszes, on 2015-June-25, 10:47, said:

YMM obviously V sorry but I cannot figure that out, can you please clarify?

Your mileage may (obviously) vary.

In other words, you may have different results. Putting the "obviously" in the middle of YMMV is an interesting touch.



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#13 User is offline   wank 

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Posted 2015-June-25, 14:45

2s is a horrible bid, but you can bid whatever you like. if you bid 2s and got a good result, you're lucky but you've done nothing wrong.
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#14 User is offline   PhantomSac 

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Posted 2015-June-25, 15:30

Way out of order, you need a TIME OUT!
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#15 User is offline   Adam1105 

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Posted 2015-June-25, 21:41

The bid did in fact keep our opps out of a make-able 3NT contract. And we made some points on the scorecard consequently. Though I'm, based on the responses, still not sure my bid was proper. I try always to play properly at the bridge table so I'll try to have "at least one honor" from now on in my six card suit. I kinda think the suggestion that a "1S bid was better" was the right bid.
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#16 User is offline   neilkaz 

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Posted 2015-June-25, 22:47

View PostPhantomSac, on 2015-June-25, 15:30, said:

Way out of order, you need a TIME OUT!

Yes, sit in the corner and be happy your parents don't believe in spanking.
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#17 User is offline   Vampyr 

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Posted 2015-June-26, 00:40

View PostAdam1105, on 2015-June-25, 21:41, said:

The bid did in fact keep our opps out of a make-able 3NT contract. And we made some points on the scorecard consequently. Though I'm, based on the responses, still not sure my bid was proper. I try always to play properly at the bridge table so I'll try to have "at least one honor" from now on in my six card suit. I kinda think the suggestion that a "1S bid was better" was the right bid.

Although most people who replied to your question thought your bid was terrible, the only person whose opinion really matters is partner. A "proper" bid is one that conforms to the partnership's agreements.
I know not with what weapons World War III will be fought, but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones -- Albert Einstein
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#18 User is offline   wank 

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Posted 2015-June-26, 03:56

Well that's obviously untrue. You can agree that opening 7nt shows 4333 15 count. Lo and behold you pick up a 4333 15 count. You open 7nt and go for 2300. "Oh no, i'm not an idiot, it was systemic," isn't a good defense.
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#19 User is offline   MrAce 

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Posted 2015-June-26, 04:19

View Postwank, on 2015-June-26, 03:56, said:

Well that's obviously untrue. You can agree that opening 7nt shows 4333 15 count. Lo and behold you pick up a 4333 15 count. You open 7nt and go for 2300. "Oh no, i'm not an idiot, it was systemic," isn't a good defense.


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#20 User is offline   Trinidad 

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Posted 2015-June-26, 06:34

Just my $0.02:

Pass = 10
2 = 9
1 = 3

Why am I so negative about 1? Because I may be forced to bid once more and the only possible rebid I have is in spades. Then I will be showing a six card suit. Partner will notice that I didn't make a weak jump overcall, despite my six card suit. He will conclude that the reason for that is that I was too strong for a weak jump and will play me for an opening hand.

So, if I have to choose between telling my partner that I have six spades and a weak hand and telling him that I have six spades and an opening, I will pick the weak hand by making a weak jump overcall.

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