[Cascade]

I wouldn't complain if partner opened 1♠.

We tend not to open 2♠ with four hearts. Our 2♠ promises five or six spades.

If we did open 2♠ then with the example hand opposite we would have a chance of getting to 7♥ via:

2♠ 2NT
3♥ maximum with three hearts
...... 3NT
4♥ six spades and four hearts now
...... 4NT RKC
5♦ 1 or 4
...... 5NT Kings - Grand Slam try
7♥ Spade King

[luke warm]

i'd pass ... in tempo

[fred]

I would pass. I can understand 2S. I can't understand 1S.

Anyone who claims that any of the choices are "right" or "wrong" just doesn't get it. This is a style question that each partnership has to work out. The way I learned to play bridge, opening bids were really opening bids. It is hard to change your ways after 20+ years of playing a certain way, but I would never claim that I know it is "wrong" to open 1S - just that I would not be comfortable playing in a partnership that bid that way.

Fred Gitelman
Bridge Base Inc.
www.bridgebase.com

PS Hats off to Jlall who shows uncommon wisdom for such a young player (and he also happens to be good with suit combinations).

[whereagles]

Only 18? You noob!

[joker_gib]

Jlall, on Jan 6 2005, 02:29 AM, said:

hey who are you calling young, im 18 now jk lol

Hey Justin, when did you start to play ?

At the age of 4 like Mozart !

[nikos59]

I would not open 1S.
When the Great Shuffler gives me KJTxxx in spades,
He does not intend me to pass.

Hence, a 2S opener, warts and all.

[inquiry]

Couple of hanging issues. I hope everyone noticed that I gave my 2S-bid grand slam auction with smileys and all....

Second, if I sat down opposite 95% of players I play with, I would not open this 1♠. One can only open these hands if your partner understands you bid this way. So if the question was, what do you bid with a random partner, 1♠ is obioulsy out.

Ben

[EricK]

Jlall, on Jan 6 2005, 04:41 AM, said:

nice auctions to 7H after 2H opening with the hand Ax, AQxx, Axx, Axxx. I doubt at the table anyone would have an auction other than 2S-4S. Please get real.

It is rather disingenuous to use a missed grand slam in ♥ as a possible reason to avoid opening 2♠ with a side 4 card major. The last time I checked, a making grand slam in ♣ also scores better than a ♠ game, but I don't hear many people recommending that one doesn't open a weak 2 with a side 4 card minor. I accept that the possibility of missed game in 4♥ is a counterargument to pre-empting.

Quote

The goal of bidding is to get to the right contract while giving away the least information possible, the former being more important than the latter.

Isn't this also the opponent's goal in bidding? So isn't another of our goals in bidding to make it hard for them to find their right contract? This is, after all, one of the main reasons for pre-empting.

Quote

I could not imagine opening anything other than 2S with AKxxxx xxxx x xx. That hand is very different because it is preemptive in nature. Pure, 100 % of values in spades, 6-4 shape etc. Its screaming spades, and screaming preempt. The hand in question seems like its not very preemptive in nature. Soft values, alot of defense for everything except 5D (even then the DJ and the KJs could set them).

Pre-empting can gain in a number of ways. One of those ways is to cause the opponents to overbid and then we can defeat them. This is more likely if we have defensive values, than if we have a "pure" pre-empt. If the opponent's overcall the pre-empt (as opponent's often do) I would much rather have the given hand than your example hand.

Quote

Since no initial action is appropriate, pass is the best option, you will get another chance and will have a better idea of what's going on.

You will often get another chance. But you will also often have to guess what to do at the 3 level. If it starts 1♦ 3♦ you have the choice of bidding 3♠ which is one level higher than your opening would have been and is even more likely to miss a ♥ game, or of doubling, which has the serious risk of getting to the wrong major, or of passing again, which seems rather pusillanimous.

I am not saying you are wrong, but you were only giving one side of the argument. 2♠ will sometimes gain over pass, and it will sometimes lose over Pass. I honestly wonder whether the gains outweigh the losses or vice versa.

Eric

[han]

I think this hand is very close between 1S and 2S. I don't think I'd ever pass it when playing with my regular partners. When vulnerable I would open 2S without a problem, here, I think I'd go with 1S.

[mikestar]

I like 2S but understand pass. I wouldn't open 1S unless playing with a regular partner and with a system adapted to light openers (as Ben does).


With regard to the side 4 card major, this cuts both ways. If partner has four hearts we may miss a game, but if he has a stiff heart they may stretch to 4H and go down when they would have stopped in a heart partial if I had passed.

[Gerben47]

I'm getting old. Anyway, playing with anyone I know this is not close to 1♠. I'm sure there are some that will play openings like this but I shiver what that does to the rest of my system... Well in Precision it's probably no problem but Zar was considering a standard system right?

Anyway, 2♠. Good suit, good values, no 1st round control. With a second flaw (for example an ace or a void) I'd pass.

[dogsbreath]

hi
I dont see how y can open this 1S unless yr system is tailored to deal with light opening bids. Dont care for 2S either with such a poor suit.. but at least doesnt distort the strength of the hand. (call me old-fashioned )
Rgds Dog

[fred]

One of my personal rules for opening the bidding at the 1-level is that you should have good reason to believe that the opponents are not laydown for 7NT.

Fred Gitelman
Bridge Base Inc.
www.bridgebase.com

[the hog]

Pass. I don't mind having 4H, but this H suit is too good for a 2S opening.

[Free]

The_Hog, on Jan 7 2005, 02:02 AM, said:

Pass. I don't mind having 4H, but this H suit is too good for a 2S opening.

Exactly my thought! I also don't mind 4 small ♥s, but this suit is way too good to be left behind.

[Flame]

I dont like 1S because the hand totally lack quick tricks, this hand will be worth its opening if partner has support but otherwise it wont and partner will count on getting little more.
2S is imo better but the problem is the heart suit. so ill pass it.

[tinywingz]

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