[Cyberyeti]

---

The full story:

This is my partner's hand, and is a horrible decision she faced. We were playing the final of the county knockout teams, their team had unexpectedly made the final, and one of them dropped out so I filled the gap as I hadn't played in the qualifier. This was board 41/48 at which point we were 36 down. Both our pairs did well in the rest of the set, we lost by 11 overall, more than that was lost on this board.

This is the first time you've played together and you have no sophisticated methods whatsoever.

Edit:- Basic system is Acol weak no trump, but I suspect that doesn't matter much.

[hrothgar]

Cyberyeti, on 2013-April-02, 04:52, said:

---

The full story:

This is my partner's hand, and is a horrible decision she faced. We were playing the final of the county knockout teams, their team had unexpectedly made the final, and one of them dropped out so I filled the gap as I hadn't played in the qualifier. This was board 41/48 at which point we were 36 down. Both our pairs did well in the rest of the set, we lost by 11 overall, more than that was lost on this board.

This is the first time you've played together and you have no sophisticated methods whatsoever.

I simply bid 4S, and expect to make

Parter could easily hold something like the following where slam looks to be good

S K
H Axxxx
D QJTx
C 452

However, bidding the slam requires either Diamond intermediates or top clubs for pitches.

[Hanoi5]

I don't quite see an alternative to 4♠. 5♠ might seem like a slam try looking for honors in spades, the fourth suit might bring the knowledge of partner's 3 spades but all that is speculative, I think I'd just take the jump and expect partner to 'move' further if he has the proper hand.

[CamHenry]

Cyberyeti, on 2013-April-02, 04:52, said:

---

The full story:

This is my partner's hand, and is a horrible decision she faced. We were playing the final of the county knockout teams, their team had unexpectedly made the final, and one of them dropped out so I filled the gap as I hadn't played in the qualifier. This was board 41/48 at which point we were 36 down. Both our pairs did well in the rest of the set, we lost by 11 overall, more than that was lost on this board.

This is the first time you've played together and you have no sophisticated methods whatsoever.

Obvious options are 3♣ - 4sf, planning to bid 4♠ unless partner shows something exciting such as 5-5 reds and a direct 4♠. I'm going for 3♣; if partner can't show anything magic I'll just bid 4♠.

[Cyberyeti]

hrothgar, on 2013-April-02, 05:25, said:

I simply bid 4S, and expect to make

Parter could easily hold something like the following where slam looks to be good

S K
H Axxxx
D QJTx
C 452

However, bidding the slam requires either Diamond intermediates or top clubs for pitches.

Partner could have Ax, Axxxx, KQxx, xx where the small slam is laydown and the grand is good, he could equally have x, KJxxx, Jxxx, AKQ where even 4 is no play without a club lead or the spade honours crashing.

[Phil352]

When you say no system, was weak jump shifts discussed? ie. is 3S going to be forcing? If it is that seems logical. If not I'll need to think some more.

[Codo]

You did not discuss a way to show a near solid nine bagger missing the ace and the king? Shame on you...
I try 3 ♠ if this is forcing, else 3 ♣ followed by 4 ♠.

[TWO4BRIDGE]

Cyberyeti, on 2013-April-02, 04:52, said:

---

sidebar:
Meckwell uses 2S for this particular sequence as a GF ... rather than 4th suit ( 3C ):

1H - 1S
2D - 2S ( GF )

Next, 3S by responder would set trumps and initiate control cuebidding .

[Cyberyeti]

Phil352, on 2013-April-02, 06:35, said:

When you say no system, was weak jump shifts discussed? ie. is 3S going to be forcing? If it is that seems logical. If not I'll need to think some more.

Strong jump shifts.

3♠ undiscussed.

[mr1303]

I bid 4S until I read the state of the match where I discover I'm 30 something down with about 7 boards left to play. I need a swing. I therefore make a try. 5S now might be reasonable. Please note that I don't recommend this bid unless there are state of the match issues.

[Cyberyeti]

mr1303, on 2013-April-02, 16:38, said:

I bid 4S until I read the state of the match where I discover I'm 30 something down with about 7 boards left to play. I need a swing. I therefore make a try. 5S now might be reasonable. Please note that I don't recommend this bid unless there are state of the match issues.

This I think is more or less what partner thought.

Unfortunately I've been brought up to bid purely according to my spade honours in this type of auction without exclusion available, so I bid 6 with:

K
KJ10xx
J10xx
Axx

This didn't have a lot of play after they cashed the A♥ at trick 1, but you don't make 5 either most of the time. Unfortunately team mates couldn't save us, I don't know how the diamonds actually sat, but it would seem that A♥, A♠ and another spade might beat 4.

[gszes]

w/o decent asking bids your partnership has no way to
make decent overtures toward slam. This is still a game
of % and your side is a much greater favorite to make 4s
than to make 6/7 spades. Stick with the % move and

bid 4s.


State of match?

you are two decent swings down with 8 boards to go I see no reason to
try and assume this has to be one of those boards where the odds seem
stacked against us. You also have a chance for a decent swing on this
board if the sophisticated methods of the opps propel them to the 5 level
and it turns out to be too high. Sit back relax and save the gambles for
really desparate times.

[Cyberyeti]

gszes, on 2013-April-02, 16:59, said:

w/o decent asking bids your partnership has no way to
make decent overtures toward slam. This is still a game
of % and your side is a much greater favorite to make 4s
than to make 6/7 spades. Stick with the % move and

bid 4s.


State of match?

you are two decent swings down with 8 boards to go I see no reason to
try and assume this has to be one of those boards where the odds seem
stacked against us. You also have a chance for a decent swing on this
board if the sophisticated methods of the opps propel them to the 5 level
and it turns out to be too high. Sit back relax and save the gambles for
really desparate times.

We were 36 down, so 3-4 decent swings, it was fairly desperate.

Sadly on the other boards, opps bid 3 games we stayed out of that went off, and team mates bid and made 2 indifferent games where we played the hands in 1♠ going off, so we subsequently got 2x11, 2x5, 1x6 in the plus column. The outrageous board was one where team mates bid 3N with Qx opposite Jx in a side suit, took their 9 top tricks when it wasn't led and we then pointed out to them that it was cold as the suit was AK tight opposite 7 to the 10 and no entry.

[rhm]

Cyberyeti, on 2013-April-02, 06:25, said:

Partner could have Ax, Axxxx, KQxx, xx where the small slam is laydown and the grand is good, he could equally have x, KJxxx, Jxxx, AKQ where even 4 is no play without a club lead or the spade honours crashing.

How likely is it that opponents with 11 clubs between them and all club honors would keep quiet.
3♣ scares me because they may have a very cheap save in clubs.

Cyberyeti, on 2013-April-02, 04:52, said:

Edit:- Basic system is Acol weak no trump, but I suspect that doesn't matter much.

It certainly does.
With 2-5-4-2 and a club honor I would not expect partner to bid 2♦ if in 1NT rebidding range. So if 2-5-4-2 partner is minimum.
But otherwise 2♦ is more likely to show an unbalanced hand. Guess where your partner is likely to be short.
Of course if partner has a singleton spade (a big if) there is still a 50% chance that his spade singleton is an honor, but slam may still not be good.
The choice is between 4♠ and 5♠.
My choice is 4♠.
I would not expect partner to pass with good spade support (say ♠AK), because I did not bid 4♠ (no kickback for me) immediately and 1♠ followed by 4♠ must show a hand too strong for an immediate 4♠ bid, in particular when partner rebid made it likely being short in spades.

Rainer Herrmann

[Free]

TWO4BRIDGE, on 2013-April-02, 07:06, said:

sidebar:
Meckwell uses 2S for this particular sequence as a GF ... rather than 4th suit ( 3C ):

1H - 1S
2D - 2S ( GF )

Next, 3S by responder would set trumps and initiate control cuebidding .

Important side note: they can do this because they play 1♥-2♠ as a weak jump and 1♥-1♠-...-3♠ as an invitational hand with 6+♠. When you don't play weak jumps, this method isn't possible.

Without agreements (like stated in the subject) I'd start with 1♠ and jump to 4♠.

[HeartA]

4♠. WTP?

[Fluffy]

3♣ is obvious, if partner bids 3♠ over that we might find grand slam.

[PhilKing]

Fluffy, on 2013-April-05, 07:39, said:

3♣ is obvious, if partner bids 3♠ over that we might find grand slam.

Is Ken Rexford in da house?

[rhm]

Fluffy, on 2013-April-05, 07:39, said:

3♣ is obvious, if partner bids 3♠ over that we might find grand slam.

Yeah completely obvious.
With 12 or 13 clubs between silent opponents, one with a void in spades the other poor guy holding only a singleton in that suit I guess one has lost consciousness while the other is suffering a heart attack at the moment.
Call the ambulance before playing your grand.

Rainer Herrmann

[lesh]

I would bid 4♠ to play and hope we make it.