[Jinksy]

xxxx
-
AKxx
AKQJx

opposite

AKQ9x
xxx
QJx
xx

N deals and bids 1C (Acol, showing 4+), and the bidding proceeds with no passing

1H (ocall) 1S 4H 4S

all pass.

[Bbradley62]

Who bid hearts?

[Hanoi5]

The culprit is north, I'd say.

[the hog]

I don't understand the bidding.

[Cascade]

the hog, on 2011-October-02, 18:03, said:

I don't understand the bidding.

I think it is meant to be competitive with all four players bidding.

[TWO4BRIDGE]

Jinksy, on 2011-October-02, 17:08, said:

xxxx
-
AKxx
AKQJx

opposite

AKQ9x
xxx
QJx
xx

N deals, and the bidding goes 1C 1H 1S 4H 4S all pass.

1C - ( 1H ) - 1S - ( 4H )
5S! - ( p ) - 5NT! - ( p )
7S
where:
... 1S = 5+ cards
... 5S! = Bid 6S w/2 of the top 3 honors
...5NT! = Josephine = all 3 top honors
... 7S = counting on 5s, 2d, 4 or 5c, and 1 or 2 Ht-ruffs = 13

[Bbradley62]

TWO4BRIDGE, on 2011-October-02, 20:13, said:

...5NT! = Josephine = all 3 top honors

This is cool, but how common is it?

[mikestar13]

TWO4BRIDGE, on 2011-October-02, 20:13, said:

1C - ( 1H ) - 1S - ( 4H )
5S! - ( p ) - 5NT! - ( p )
7S
where:
... 1S = 5+ cards
... 5S! = Bid 6S w/2 of the top 3 honors
...5NT! = Josephine = all 3 top honors
... 7S = counting on 5s, 2d, 4 or 5c, and 1 or 2 Ht-ruffs = 13

Better is a direct 7♠ over 5♠: if partner can make 6 without a spade honor in his hand when you have merely good trumps, odds have to be excellent for 7 opposite your actual trumps.

[Jinksy]

Clarified the sequence above.

[MickyB]

Did 1♠ show five cards? If so, North definitely has to do more. If not, North rates to have a better hand for his 4♠ bid, and South should make a move IMO.

[Jinksy]

Clarified the bidding in the OP.

Re MickyB, not explicitly agreed.

[whereagles]

North should definitely bid 5H. You might not reach 7, but at least to 6 you're good.

South could have helped, but it's far from clear to move over 4S because opener was underpressure, in which case the 4S bid might have been subpar.

[Jinksy]

Disclosure - I was S and passed on whereagles reasoning. If 5S asks for 2 of the top three honours, it's a no brainer.

My view after the fact was that, with no specific system available, N should bid 6H - sure, p might put down QJxxx in S and a Q somewhere, but over 5H (or any bid that might be taken as seeking 'extras') seems likely to sign off with hands like KQxxx or KJxxxx and out.

[mikeh]

There's no doubt that this was entirely N's fault for that silly 4♠ call. He has the world's easiest 5♥call, whioh is unfortunately not exclusion (not a jump) but which delivers a heart control.

I think S, who has significant undisclosed values, can bid 7♠ so long as 5♥ is understood to show 1st round heart control.

At least in my partnerships, 4N by North would be keycard in spades, rather than two places to play (a common meaning for 4N in competition), and thus 5♥ would show 1st round control. 4N would be a similar hand with a stiff, and 5♠ would be inviting slam if responder controlled hearts. Now, responder can, on this hand, deduce that 5♠ can't mean that, because North can't have such good spades as to know slam depends on the heart situation, but it is madness to define the meaning of bids by reference to what partner holds.

Thus AKxx xx A AKJxxx would be a 5♠ bid on the same auction....maybe responder bid 1♠ on QJxxx xx Qxx Qxx.

[TWO4BRIDGE]

mikeh, on 2011-October-04, 15:13, said:

I think S, who has significant undisclosed values, can bid 7♠ so long as 5♥ is understood to show 1st round heart control.

5♠ would be inviting slam if responder controlled hearts. Now, responder can, on this hand, deduce that 5♠ can't mean that, because North can't have such good spades as to know slam depends on the heart situation, but it is madness to define the meaning of bids by reference to what partner holds.

I have to agree with you that since our side has NOT made a Ctrl cuebid in opps' suit ( ♥ ) , that 5S! should actually be asking for at least 2nd Rnd Ctrl in ♥ to bid 6S.

I was so enthralled with the Josephine Reply for trump quality ( named after Culbertson's wife ) that I overlooked that aspect.

So, technically, 5S is not right, and your 5H! cue ( promising 1st Rnd Ctrl -- more than likely a Void, since you otherwise might have bid 4NT-RKC for Sp ) is better !

But that brings up another point that you addressed: Would it be too far-fetched for the 5-of-trump to mean: either/or ??
... a ) trump quality or
... b ) Ctrl in opps' suit

If partner had at least 2 of the top, it must be a trump quality-ask.
If partner had One or none, it must be a Ctrl-ask.

Here, however, you would have been in trouble if partner had ONE of the top 3 AND the K x or A of ♥.

[ I tend to make the 5-of-trump bid with a void , ergo most of my 5M-asks are for trump quality ].

[TWO4BRIDGE]

mikeh, on 2011-October-04, 15:13, said:

I think S, who has significant undisclosed values, can bid 7♠ so long as 5♥ is understood to show 1st round heart control.

5♠ would be inviting slam if responder controlled hearts. Now, responder can, on this hand, deduce that 5♠ can't mean that, because North can't have such good spades as to know slam depends on the heart situation, but it is madness to define the meaning of bids by reference to what partner holds.

I have to agree with you that since our side has NOT made a Ctrl cuebid in opps' suit ( ♥ ) , that 5S! should actually be asking for at least 2nd Rnd Ctrl in ♥ to bid 6S.

I was so enthralled with the Josephine Reply for trump quality ( named after Culbertson's wife ) that I overlooked that aspect.

So, technically, 5S is not right, and your 5H! cue ( promising 1st Rnd Ctrl -- more than likely a Void, since you otherwise might have bid 4NT-RKC for Sp ) is better !

But that brings up another point that you addressed: Would it be too far-fetched for the 5-of-trump to mean: either/or ??
... a ) trump quality or
... b ) Ctrl in opps' suit

If partner had at least 2 of the top, it must be a trump quality-ask.
If partner had One or none, it must be a Ctrl-ask.

Here, however, you would have been in trouble if partner had ONE of the top 3 AND the K x or A of ♥.

[ I tend to make the 5-of-trump bid with a void , ergo most of my 5M-asks are for trump quality ].