[luis]

South American Championship Semi Final.
You are always in SOUTH

1) You have: x, Axxx, AKxxx, Axx (Everybody VUL)
Your pd opens 1c and the bidding goes
West North East South(You)
1c p 1d
p 1h p 1s(4sgf)
p 2s p 3h
p 3s p 4c
p 4h p ?

Pd bids are natural. What is your bid?

2) You have: x, J9xxxx, xx, Txxx (EW vul)
The bidding
West North East South(You)
1d 1s 2s* p
3s 4c 4h p
6d p p ?

2s showed support for diammonds. Your bid?

3) You have: (All Vulnerable)
x, 8xxx, 9xxxx, 9xx
Nice hand ah? The bidding: (playing strong NTs admiiting a 5M)
West North East South(You)
1NT p p
2c 2s x ?

The double is for penalties. Your bid?

[pbleighton]

1) Bid 6H, in spite of patner's 4H. Ha had started a slam investigation, and was disappointed in you club response - he was hoping for diamonds. Go for it.
2) Favorable vulnerability - bid 7 clubs.
3) Pass. Partner probably has 6 spades, which means probably less than 3 diamonds, and quite possibly no honors.

[Codo]

1) You have: x, Axxx, AKxxx, Axx (Everybody VUL)

6 Heart Not enough for 7, no need to search for aces or more informations and give infos away...

2) You have: x, J9xxxx, xx, Txxx (EW vul)

7 club as an insurance. If we beat 6 Diamond (How?) it will be not too expensive.

3) You have: (All Vulnerable)
x, 8xxx, 9xxxx, 9xx
Nice hand ah?
My pd won´t bid like that, but I will pass. He did not want to here my bid, he wanted to bid on his own. Okay, glP maybe he psyched....

Kind Regards

Roland

[inquiry]

Interesting puzzles Luis. A chance to discuss a two favorite convention I like (hand 1), explore LOTT once more (hand 2) which will no doubt give Misho more evidence that LOTT is useless , and well, suffer the pains of this game (hand 3)

1) You have: x, Axxx, AKxxx, Axx (Everybody VUL)
Your pd opens 1c and the bidding goes
West North East South(You)
1c p 1d
p 1h p 1s(4sgf)
p 2s p 3h
p 3s p 4c
p 4h p ?

Pd bids are natural. What is your bid?

This is a good advertisement for Serious 3NT/LTTC. You made a slam try, partner 3S bid should not have to show any extra values, here it was a mandatory cue-bid. I would have bid 3N over 3S (obsessively serious 3NT) to give partner an opportunity to cue bid 4C (no real need for serious 3NT per se, as I have already shown slam interest, but give partner a chance to cue in clubs) but its too late now. Partner will be 4-4-1-4, 4-4-0-5 or 4-4-2-3 for this auction. It would be nice to know if 3S promised SA or either A/K, the way I play, it promises only a Spade control, not specifically the ACE. But for this auction, I will assume the ACE for this natural cue bid. It would have also been nice to be playing LTTC, partner could have bid 4D as with a little extra (that is not showing a Diamond control). Missing out on Serious 3NT/LTTC, I am now forced to guess. Does partner have a yucky minimum like AKxx Kxxx x QJxx where 4H is high enough? We need, in addition to SPADE ACE, a good heart holding (KQxx or better would be great), and at least KJ in clubs. The perfect hand would be this chunky minimum S-Axxx H-KQxx D-Qx C-Kxx, and but partner surely wouldn't bid 4H with that one, as it is a golden hand for this auction.

Now, being forced to guess because LTTC and S3NT are not in my bag of tricks, I will bid 4S over 4H, by inference promising a Diamond stopper, showing second round control in spades, and see what partner does. Unlike the previous posters, I am willing to sell out to 5H's. If partner bids 4N I play Kantar RKB, and I would clearly be the strong hand on this auction, so I would bid 5C showing 3 controls. Then if we need the heart queen, partner can check for it with a 5D Queen asking bid. This allows us to stop in 5H if partner held something like S-AJxx H-Kxxx D-x C-KQxx

BTW, if I was playing LTTC and partner bid 4H over 4C, I pass with this hand. LTTC is "Last train to Clarksville" and if you don’t know what it is, look for it under the BBO Standard advanced in the "bridge training room" at the BBO site.

For the direct 6H bidders, hope you don't catch your partner with S-AQJx H-Jxxx D-x C-KQxx where you have two fairly sure heart losers. A 5D bid over 4H (placing emphasis on Heart needs) would at least avoid this disaster

2) You have: x, J9xxxx, xx, Txxx (EW vul)
The bidding
West North East South(You)
1d 1s 2s* p
3s 4c 4h p
6d p p ?

2s showed support for diamonds. Your bid?

My bid is PASS. Long winded explanation.

Partner needs at least 5C's for his 4C bid, so we have a minimum of a 9 card club fit. They rate to have a 9 to 10 card diamond fit (most is 11 if partner is void). So we will call it 9.5 and 9.5, for a total of 19 tricks. I see no additions from good intermediates nor subtractions for our holding honors in their suit, however we are likely have a minus for intermediates in clubs. But, the vulnerability suggest an aggressive view, so I will assume 19 tricks.

If they can make 12 tricks in Diamonds, then 7Cx is down 6. So pass loses 1370, and bidding 7C loses 1400. Hardly a ringing endorsement for bidding on. What if there are 20 tricks (say we both have 10 card fits), now we might squeeze by in 7C for down only 1100, versus minus 1370. All in all, I would "risk" a +100 for them going down one rather than take the sac at 7C.

Likely Results with 19 tricks
(their tricks) Imp swing for 7C
11 6D +100 7Cx -1100 -17
12 6D -1370 7Cx -1400 -1
13 6D -1390 7Cx -1700 -7
13 7D -2140 7Cx -1700 -13/-7 (*)

* -13 versus letting them play 6D if you push them, -7 if they wack you in 7Cs (most likely result as they will take their sure plus over 7C than risk 7D... but if they make a forcing pass of 7C, who knows, they may bid a makeable 7D).

Likely Results with 20 tricks
(their tricks) Imp swing for 7C
11 6D +100 7Cx -800 -14
12 6D -1370 7Cx -1100 +7
13 6D -1390 7Cx -1400 0
13 7D -2140 7Cx -1400 -12/0 (*)

Likely Results with 21 tricks
Likely Results with 19 tricks
(their tricks) Imp swing for 7C
11 6D +100 7Cx -500 -12
12 6D -1370 7Cx -800 +11
13 6D -1390 7Cx -1100 +7
13 7D -2140 7Cx -1100 -13/+7 (*)

The best hand you could imagine for partner is a nice fat 6-6 hand with a diamond void. Something like S-KQxxxx H-x D-void C-AKQxxx would be perfect. This "freak" would make this not a 21 trick hand, but a 22 to 24 trick hand. You can expect to lose just 1H, 1S (maybe a second S if suit splits badly and they lead trumps), going down 2 or 3 in 7Cx. They on the other hand, may well lose 1C and 1S. So it is a 22-23 trick hand. But at favorable vulnerability, partner would not bid a tame 4C on this hand, or anything wildly distributional like this. Any red-blooded bidder would leap to 5C or 6C over 3S. So I believe partner really will be limited to 5 Clubs here. That is, I do not believe partner can hold this wonderful hand on this auction.

So from the tables, with a 19 trick hand (and it could be an 18 trick hand, as both sides may have only 9 card fits. It is even possible they have only 8 card fit for 17), pass wins everytime. With a 20 trick hand, 7C wins in only once case. Once you get to a 21 trick plus hand, bidding 7C becomes a better option. I do not think partner can have 6C and diamond void, so the 21 trick hand is probably not realistic. The 22-23 trick freak hand should not be possible on the given auction.

3) You have: (All Vulnerable)
x, 8xxx, 9xxxx, 9xx
Nice hand ah? The bidding: (playing strong NTs admiiting a 5M)
West North East South(You)
1NT p p
2c 2s x ?

The double is for penalties. Your bid?

Yuck. We would sit at the table for a long, long time as I cursed my partner's ancestors for their demonstrated lack of foresight for choosing to have children quietly under my breath. In the final analysis I would decide that partner must know what she was doing and pass as a redouble seems sure to get us out of spades, but not clear 3 of anything would be any better.

[hrothgar]

There are two different issues here.

The first is how SAYC systemically defines bidding sequences.
SAYC is intended as a standardized system. Regardless of whether or not you agree with individual treatments, you don't get to redefine the system but sill claim that you are playing SAYC. I hate using the auctions 1C - 2N / 1D - 2N as forcing bids. However, if I agree to play SAYC I do so. In a similar fashion, SAYC requires that responder take a rebid after his/her 2/1. This means that if you are playing SAYC, you don't get to pass opener's rebid since he could be temporizing.

The second issue is whether SAYC is a good system.
I think that the system is severely flawed.

It is a bad system.
It is poorly designed to teach to novices.
It is too ambguous to use as an kind of standard.

the worst thing that online bridge ever did was resurrecting SAYC from the dustbin of history.

[Gerardo]

Luis, I recognized hand 3 ;-)

Hand before that EW had a 4Sx+2, so N tried a misrepresentation of his hand to create a swing back. He had 6 spades (for sure), and 14 HCP if I remember well. Partner tried XX, which he passed, down 1. They have a 8-card fit in diamonds.

They argued about this hand all over that session, even more than the X with 2 overtricks of the previous hand

Final note (for cursing Ben ;-): Other room was 3NT+1 by EW, so it represented 6 IMPs even XX-1, would have been 10 without the XX. North is a GREAT player ;-) (not [just] for this hand, he just got what he wished here, but XX. Maybe he was lucky, but he did it on purpose).

You NEVER know ;-)

[inquiry]

Quote

Final note (for cursing Ben ;-): Other room was 3NT+1 by EW, so it represented 6 IMPs even XX-1, would have been 10 without the XX. North is a GREAT player ;-) (not [just] for this hand, he just got what he wished here, but XX. Maybe he was lucky, but he did it on purpose)
You NEVER know ;-)

Thanks Gerardo,

Well... hehe, I was wondering if Luis was ever going to post the solutions to these (are you?)... It's good to see that at least I (and looks everyone else) got the third one right... Because after cursing I said "In the final analysis I would decide that partner must know what she was doing and pass as a redouble seems sure to get us out of spades, but not clear 3 of anything would be any better." And look he/she did.

[luis]

Solutions:

1) You have: x, Axxx, AKxxx, Axx (Everybody VUL)
Your pd opens 1c and the bidding goes
West North East South(You)
1c p 1d
p 1h p 1s(4sgf)
p 2s p 3h
p 3s p 4c
p 4h p ?

The right move is to PASS (!!) Nobody found that. At the table North bid 4s and passed 5h by south. Unfortunately South went down in 5h.
South's hand: AQxx, QJxx, J, QTxx

2) You have: x, J9xxxx, xx, Txxx (EW vul)
The bidding
West North East South(You)
1d 1s 2s* p
3s 4c 4h p
6d p p ?

Congratulations to the 7c bidders, Aranha for Brazil did bid 7c and earned a Swing since 6d was cold and 7c went down 800.
Your pd hand? : QJTxx, Ax, x, QJTxx

3) You have: (All Vulnerable)
x, 8xxx, 9xxxx, 9xx
Nice hand ah? The bidding: (playing strong NTs admiiting a 5M)
West North East South(You)
1NT p p
2c 2s x ?

The double is for penalties. Your bid?

What a nightmare.... At the table south redoubled and north held
KT98xx, kx, Axx, Kx and played 2s xx. The defense paniced badly and declarer was down 1 for -400 when he could have been down 4 for -2200 (!!!) . As Gerardo said -400 was a good result with 3NT making at the other table. But if you passed then you got this right maybe for -1100, maybe for -200......

[inquiry]

Quote

Solutions:

1) You have: x, Axxx, AKxxx, Axx (Everybody VUL)
Your pd opens 1c and the bidding goes
West North East South(You)
1c p 1d
p 1h p 1s(4sgf)
p 2s p 3h
p 3s p 4c
p 4h p ?

The right move is to PASS (!!) Nobody found that. At the table North bid 4s and passed 5h by south. Unfortunately South went down in 5h.
South's hand: AQxx, QJxx, J, QTxx

2) You have: x, J9xxxx, xx, Txxx (EW vul)
The bidding
West North East South(You)
1d 1s 2s* p
3s 4c 4h p
6d p p ?

Congratulations to the 7c bidders, Aranha for Brazil did bid 7c and earned a Swing since 6d was cold and 7c went down 800.
Your pd hand? : QJTxx, Ax, x, QJTxx

3) You have: (All Vulnerable)
x, 8xxx, 9xxxx, 9xx
Nice hand ah? The bidding: (playing strong NTs admiiting a 5M)
West North East South(You)
1NT p p
2c 2s x ?

The double is for penalties. Your bid?

What a nightmare.... At the table south redoubled and north held
KT98xx, kx, Axx, Kx and played 2s xx. The defense paniced badly and declarer was down 1 for -400 when he could have been down 4 for -2200 (!!!) . As Gerardo said -400 was a good result with 3NT making at the other table. But if you passed then you got this right maybe for -1100, maybe for -200......

Thanks for posting the hands Luis. I will not address #3 again. Instead, I will deal with the much more interesting #1 and #2 . First, if I get a bad board on either one, I will ask them to be thrown out. On one, there are two HEART ACES, and on 2 two CLUB TENS... :-)

Let's deal with #2 first, as it goes to the LOTT thread discussed elsewhere recently. The hands you gave were:
(EW vul)
x, J9xxxx, xx, Txxx
QJTxx, Ax, x, QJTxx

This is the 19 trick LOTT hand (they have 10D, you have 9Clubs). The LAW says if they can make 12 tricks in D, you "should" be down 5 in 7C. And indeed, looking at the hands, down 5 seems all but assured for -1100 (2C, 1H, 1S, 1D). In fact, there are ways to go down 6 perhaps. If they can play three or four round of trumps for instance (it would be unlucky if clubs are 4-0). It is also possible that 6D has no play. Imagine NS hands....
[font=courier]
S-Kxx
H-KQ
D-AQT63
C-Ax

S-Axxx
H-9xx
D-KJ9xx
C-Kx

I still say risking 7C here is not a good bid. It works if a) they have a ten card fit, and they can make exactly 6 D, and even then, it is only 7 imp pick up. I think during the bidding, here you are shooting blind if you bid this. I would like to see the NS hands to see if there was a reasonable shot at beating this 6 tricks. If clubs are 3-1 there may have been a chance.

Hand #1, again, is a good advertisement for Serious 3NT and LTTC. Playing LTTC, over 4CLUBS, when opener bids 4H, you would give up. Everyone owes it to themself to at least read up on LTTC to see if it would help them with their high level quesses.

Ben