[Phil]

A Txx KQTxxx AQx

Opps silent. 1H - 2D - 2H - 3H - 4H. In your style 2H shows 6 and 3H shows extras.

Bid on?

[rogerclee]

Seems like an easy pass, there is no way partner can have either all three heart honors or two top heart honors and the DA to me.

It doesn't matter if the 5 level is safe if the 6 level sucks.

[mike777]

rogerclee, on 2011-September-08, 21:10, said:

Seems like an easy pass, there is no way partner can have either all three heart honors or two top heart honors and the DA to me.

ditto

[Phil]

This was a hand held by my LHO. My RHO made a noticeable hitch before bidding 4♥, that was agreed to. My RHO held the WORLD'S FAIR: xxx AKQxxxx Ax x.

OK, it's a regional stratified pairs, and there's plenty of randomness to go around. But LHO and RHO have 5,000 and 3,500 respectively, and they've made their living off a serious hitch and a non-serious quick signoff.

I called the director who came back a few rounds later and said "she has her bid, no adjustment". I asked if the director polled any players and she said yes. In my experience the players that get polled are other directors.

LOL.

[han]

I'd say 2000 masterpoint penalty for LHO and barred from ACBL for 3 months. RHO is not barred from ACBL but has to start over with 0 masterpoints.

Just my ruling, not sure if this agrees with ACBL laws.

[MrAce]

Phil, on 2011-September-09, 08:50, said:

This was a hand held by my LHO. My RHO made a noticeable hitch before bidding 4♥, that was agreed to. My RHO held the WORLD'S FAIR: xxx AKQxxxx Ax x.

OK, it's a regional stratified pairs, and there's plenty of randomness to go around. But LHO and RHO have 5,000 and 3,500 respectively, and they've made their living off a serious hitch and a non-serious quick signoff.

I called the director who came back a few rounds later and said "she has her bid, no adjustment". I asked if the director polled any players and she said yes. In my experience the players that get polled are other directors.

LOL.

han, on 2011-September-09, 16:35, said:

I'd say 2000 masterpoint penalty for LHO and barred from ACBL for 3 months. RHO is not barred from ACBL but has to start over with 0 masterpoints.

Just my ruling, not sure if this agrees with ACBL laws.

He did not tell us yet what happened after 4♥ bid, for which bid are you charging them ?

[whereagles]

I don't bid on because the methods have put me on a guess. Therefore I have take the average action, which is to pass.

[Phil]

han, on 2011-September-09, 16:35, said:

I'd say 2000 masterpoint penalty for LHO and barred from ACBL for 3 months. RHO is not barred from ACBL but has to start over with 0 masterpoints.

Just my ruling, not sure if this agrees with ACBL laws.

Can we transfers these points to Cherdano?

[Phil]

MrAce, on 2011-September-09, 16:49, said:

He did not tell us yet what happened after 4♥ bid, for which bid are you charging them ?

Obvious 4N!!!

Over 5♣ (RKC) LHO didn't even bother to ask for the trump Q and just bid 6. As she's putting dummy down, she said, "oh, I might have misbid this".

I'm looking at this same dummy with the crappy Txx of trump and thinking, hmmm, is this a slam try opposite a maxi weak 2 / minimum opener?

[VM1973]

rogerclee, on 2011-September-08, 21:10, said:

Seems like an easy pass, there is no way partner can have either all three heart honors or two top heart honors and the DA to me.

It doesn't matter if the 5 level is safe if the 6 level sucks.

It seems to me that you don't need all 3 heart honors... just ♥AKxxxx with the ♦A.

I counted the Zar Points of the dummy and reached 34, then I added 1 for the knowledge that there is a 9-card heart fit. Adding this to the presumed minimum opener (26) I reached 61 ZPs. That rates to take 11.8 tricks. I would definitely have bid on.

[aguahombre]

It would seem that the TD might not have had all the facts, and/or the persons asked in consult did not have everything.

With the slammish intent attached to 3H, as Phil presents it, opener's failure to bid 4D at that point blew the grand. I see no reason why the TD would allow the B.I.T. to allow them to get some of it back at 6.

Also, it sounds from the post that this pair has a known history. Was this also ignored? Most TD's (whether they admit it or not) are swayed by knowlege of prior incidents.

[Phil]

Agua, people around here don't like to call the director on their friends. You lived here, so I think you might understand.

I explained the auction to the director and told her, "I think with 3♥, A Txx KQTxxx AQx has already bid her hand".

[jdeegan]

rogerclee, on 2011-September-08, 21:10, said:

Seems like an easy pass, there is no way partner can have either all three heart honors or two top heart honors and the DA to me.

It doesn't matter if the 5 level is safe if the 6 level sucks.

Do I understand this presentation correctly? Your partner opened 1♥ and subsequently indicated a minimum opener with six hearts? ♥ AKQ and the ♦ A would, indeed, be the magic minimum, but that holding produces a laydown for SEVEN. Any number of minimums produce a laydown, or at least a 50%+ play for six. Assuming I haven't missread something, a pass here would be a nullo bid. Playing oldfashioned bridge 4♠ is clearcut. 4NT RKC may be better.

I just looked at the actual hand. It is the magic min plus a seventh trump. I probably would have cue bid the ♦ ace, but the players you describe sound like a couple of hacks, so their slight lapse of bidding judgement is probably normal for them. At least they were good enough to know not to pass. By the way, did they reach seven?

[Hanoi5]

♠KQJ
♥QJxxxx
♦xx
♣Kx

This is 12 HCP's and you could go down in 4. I'm not saying I wouldn't have continued bidding with the hand given by OP but I'm known for pushing most hands. And going down. The thing is this pair is known for this behaviour of 'helping' themselves in the bidding, and in that case I say punish them.

[Phil]

Anyone that thinks AKQxxx or 7th plus an Ace is a 'minimum'...well I can't help them.

[jdeegan]

Phil, on 2011-September-09, 21:48, said:

Anyone that thinks AKQxxx or 7th plus an Ace is a 'minimum'...well I can't help them.

UR correct, it's not a min and deserves a 4♦ Q bid, but it is 'only' 13 HCP, and ur opps are hacks. This not, imo, a very good hand to try to catch the opps for being unethical. They apparently did do a job on you, but you can't really prove it.
Most people don't appreciate that a non-serious cue of the ♦ ace is almost mandatory over 3♥ with good trumps. Even so, passing 4♥ is still not correct, imo, unless you really open light. If nothing else, trot out 4♠ and then subside. With ♥ AKJxxx and ♣ king he will get us to an excellent six. ♥ AQJxxx and ♣ king is still OK. ♠ king and ♥ AKxxxx still has some play.

[jdeegan]

Hanoi5, on 2011-September-09, 21:38, said:

♠KQJ
♥QJxxxx
♦xx
♣Kx

This is 12 HCP's and you could go down in 4. I'm not saying I wouldn't have continued bidding with the hand given by OP but I'm known for pushing most hands. And going down. The thing is this pair is known for this behaviour of 'helping' themselves in the bidding, and in that case I say punish them.

This is the sorriest possible hand one can construct. If you worry about this possibility, you are playing scared bridge, not a good idea.

[FrancesHinden]

These posts are interesting, because I would pass 4H and not consider it even worth thinking about. I realise I'm perhaps biased because this is an auction in which I play a 'frivolous' 3NT (well, frivolous 3S in fact) so 4H shows an absolute pile of rubbish, but from the OP's description they have done it the other way round and responder has already shown extras. If 3H showed 3-card support, then I can't imagine any hand with 3 key cards opposite that would call itself a minimum, for a start.

Perhaps I have too much experience of playing with partners who know what a good hand looks like.

[aguahombre]

FrancesHinden, on 2011-September-11, 03:50, said:

Perhaps I have too much experience of playing with partners who know what a good hand looks like.

A big handicap on the fora, but great IRL.