[daveharty]

---

N/S are a new partnership with few agreements. North wasn't sure if South's 2NT bid was "two suits" or "minors", hence the 4D bid rather than 4H. South underled his diamond AK and got a club ruff, so N/S were +300; who should have punished E/W for their aggressive (or suicidal) bidding?

[ArtK78]

I don't like the 2NT bid by South. He is at favorable vul with a very good hand that has defensive and offensive power. But the 2NT bid (even if the suits are misunderstood by North) conveys a purely offensive hand. So North is not in a position to punish EW.

Even after bidding 2NT, South should have doubled 5♠.

I don't see how North can double 5♠ on this auction. He has a small singleton trump opposite a partner who showed a two suiter that may be weak. His only defense is in the club suit, and, for whatever reason, he thought that his partner had clubs as one of his long suits.

I give South 80% of the blame. I give North 20% of the blame only because he did not know that his partner's suits were the red suits, and did not realize that his clubs were good on defense.

[jmcw]

E/W are out to lunch.

I agree with the 1♣ bid, I can live with the 3♠ bid under some pressure, 1♠ is not my style.

4♠ is terrible and 5♠ not much better.

North and South both had opportunity to DBL 5♠. I blame North mostly.

[Hanoi5]

N/S should get their agreements right. Maybe it would be easy to double if North supports hearts, but I doubt West would go on in the bidding in that case. I blame the lack of agreements for not doubling.

[vianu2]

I disagree with u Artk (again))))!!!!!!!!!!!
Ok u have some defenses but being short in club,I don't see the point of allowing opponents to bid on the level 1 or 2!!
You talk about misunderstanding?? Ah N with AQJ8 ♣ may think that partner has another 5 cards ? So what!
Counting his singleton spade and the 5-5 hand promised by S, then S has very few hearts!!
At that moment, N is able to know that his pair is in the game (if no more lol).
I think S is just insane bidding 4♦ . If partner has hearts, his hand is still a big one and now he has defenses also!
And Dave why do u ask us what to bid over 3spades when we don't know what is 2NT. Don't think we can make a bid covering all cases)))
I would bid 4♣ if i know 2NT is H-D. After that if any gambler will go to 4♠ either N or S will bring out 3 X not only 1.
If i'm not sure what the hell is 2NT then i bid 3NT . Simply support your partner hand when u have "fit"!!

I suppose a spade lead would work exactly the same as underleading aces))) Sometimes much better:)

[ArtK78]

vianu2, on 2011-August-12, 09:00, said:

I disagree with u Artk (again))))!!!!!!!!!!!
Ok u have some defenses but being short in club,I don't see the point of allowing opponents to bid on the level 1 or 2!!
You talk about misunderstanding?? Ah N with AQJ8 ♣ may think that partner has another 5 cards ? So what!
Counting his singleton spade and the 5-5 hand promised by S, then S has very few hearts!!
At that moment, N is able to know that his pair is in the game (if no more lol).
I think S is just insane bidding 4♦ . If partner has hearts, his hand is still a big one and now he has defenses also!
And Dave why do u ask us what to bid over 3spades when we don't know what is 2NT. Don't think we can make a bid covering all cases)))
I would bid 4♣ if i know 2NT is H-D. After that if any gambler will go to 4♠ either N or S will bring out 3 X not only 1.
If i'm not sure what the hell is 2NT then i bid 3NT . Simply support your partner hand when u have "fit"!!

I suppose a spade lead would work exactly the same as underleading aces))) Sometimes much better:)

Wow. 11 exclamation marks.

Somehow, vianu, if you disagree with me, I feel much better.

[Phil]

2N is OK. It shows the unbid suits. Always.

As South I would bid 5♣ over 4♠. I have a great hand and something like ♥A + ♦Qxxx gives me a pretty good slam. Both should double 5♠.

As far as as the EW bidding is concerned, I'm actually OK with everything up until 5♠, which is a death wish.

ArtK made me laugh this morning. WD.

[vianu2]

Phil, on 2011-August-12, 10:18, said:

As South I would bid 5♣ over 4♠. I have a great hand and something like ♥A + ♦Qxxx gives me a pretty good slam.

As far as as the EW bidding is concerned, I'm actually OK with everything up until 5♠, which is a death wish.

I understand from that post the following things:
1. Partner, having maximum X in spade, Qxxx diamond and the Ace of heart would bid 4D !!!
(only 3 exclamation marks ) .
2.Partner, with the hand God gave him, still bid well 4D !!!
(another 3 ...)
I am too old for that I' m coming to age of 99.

[daveharty]

Phil, on 2011-August-12, 10:18, said:

2N is OK. It shows the unbid suits. Always.

This is a convenient metarule, but is it necessarily true? What about over a precision 1D?

I was North, and while I was 90% certain partner had H+D, he could have bid 1NT with a light distributional takeout, and I assumed he would double with a more value-based takeout hand, so I decided it was just barely possible he had the minors. Since diamonds are the common denominator of the two possible interpretations, I decided it was safest to bid them; also my diamonds were better, which seemed a reasonable factor since diamonds and hearts are in a sense equivalent when the opponents are bidding spades, and I didn't think there was any chance whatsoever we were playing 4H on the hand. I didn't double because I thought, as ArtK78 mentioned, that partner's 2NT was often going to be a weak hand suggestive of a sacrifice. I knew that if partner DID have the reds, then my club suit was a big defensive asset, but I wasn't sure that was enough to double. Maybe that was too timid.

Vianu2, I couldn't really parse your comments, other than to understand that you think I am "just insane" for bidding 4D (I assume you meant North in that comment, rather than South). I considered jumping to 5D, but I thought I had an above-average amount of defense for the auction (assuming partner did have the red suits), so I thought 4S--which seemed to me almost certain to be bid--might not be making. Also, congratulations on your upcoming centennial.

[jdeegan]

South 100%
Odds are about 2-1 that a diamond will cash, and partner should have at least one trick, possibly more. Playing matchpoints it's within reason to take a position and pass, but imo that's not the percentage action by far.
I don't care for the 2NT overcall with AK A and a ratty ♥ suit. A double will do just fine, and it puts partner more in the picture.

[vianu2]

daveharty, on 2011-August-12, 14:30, said:

Thanks for congratulating me:). My english is playing tricks on me .I meant insane bidding not insane player .
You are not insane just not as imaginative as i am.
Can i ask you why did not you consider to bid 3NT and not 4D ? You passed 1CL so you don't have a t/o X for clubs or an overcal.
What do you need in your hand to bid 3NT now?

[BunnyGo]

vianu2, on 2011-August-12, 15:35, said:

What do you need in your hand to bid 3NT now?

I think he'd be worried that his partner would pass (especially the first time playing). If 3NT is a suggestion of a place to play, then it can't be bid. If it even might be interpreted that way, it probably shouldn't be bid. While it is a bit more flexible than 4♦, it's also a bit more dangerous.

[P_Marlowe]

Hi,

to answer the question - neither North nor South.

4D from North sounded like a inite to sac. against 4S, 5D was
accepting the invite, neither side showed defensive values, thats it.

And you got 300, if you made your game, you would have gotten 400, so
you more or less got your money.

You have to assume, that they are sane, if diamonds dont case, you
fairly fast construct hands, when 5S makes, be happy you got 300, if you
made your game, you would have gotten 400, so you more or less got your
money.

I am not sure, I like underleading the AK in diamaonds, ... it worked, thats
what we see, how would South feel, if the Single Queen of diamonds makes
the trick ..., maybe if you assume sane bidding, but than they have a diamond
void.

With kind regards
Marlowe