[dae]

Does UNT apply over weak 2 bids? as-2S,4NT?

[matmat]

I've not seen an "unusual NT" in this situation, but many partnerships play leaping michaels.

[Mbodell]

I would expect 4nt over an opponent's weak two to be straight blackwood. I agree that leaping Michaels would handle strong 2 suiters with a major, with strong 2 suiters with minors you can double first (although this isn't totally safe as partner can leave it in and/or he auction can get high quickly with jumps by partner and/or opponents in the majors). I can see an argument for 4nt as strong with the minors, and I play it as the minors over an opponents 1 level bid with most of my partners, but not over 2 level bids - I think.

[the hog]

I would expect (2M) 4NT to be a big minor 2 suited takeout.

[gordontd]

Mbodell, on 2011-July-25, 00:43, said:

I would expect 4nt over an opponent's weak two to be straight blackwood. I agree that leaping Michaels would handle strong 2 suiters with a major, with strong 2 suiters with minors you can double first (although this isn't totally safe as partner can leave it in and/or he auction can get high quickly with jumps by partner and/or opponents in the majors). I can see an argument for 4nt as strong with the minors, and I play it as the minors over an opponents 1 level bid with most of my partners, but not over 2 level bids - I think.

I'd expect 4NT to be the minors: any hand that wants to Blackwood can start with a takeout double.

[Cyberyeti]

gordontd, on 2011-July-25, 01:19, said:

I'd expect 4NT to be the minors: any hand that wants to Blackwood can start with a takeout double.

You really want to start with a double with AKQ to 10 A, x, x and defend 2 doubled ?

[gordontd]

Cyberyeti, on 2011-July-25, 01:35, said:

You really want to start with a double with AKQ to 10 A, x, x and defend 2 doubled ?

I'll worry about that hand while getting to the best spot with my minor two-suiters.

[the hog]

Cyberyeti, on 2011-July-25, 01:35, said:

You really want to start with a double with AKQ to 10 A, x, x and defend 2 doubled ?

Get real. How many of those do you pick up as opposed to good minor 2 suiters? And anyway, you could start this with a double.

[helene_t]

Undiscussed I would take it as minors. But what is (2♠)-4♠? Some play as showing minors, too, but a better hand.

[P_Marlowe]

UNT applies, if a natural NT overcall does not make any sense.

Overcalling a natural 4NT over 2Sdoes not make any sense, you have
2NT / 3NT and NT bids after a X, those options cover all bases.

A 4NT overcall meant to ask for Aces is not natural, and usually it
is more important to find the right game contract instead of reaching
slam.

With kind regards
Marlowe

[Cyberyeti]

gordontd, on 2011-July-25, 01:49, said:

I'll worry about that hand while getting to the best spot with my minor two-suiters.

My point was your contention that

Quote

any hand that wants to Blackwood can start with a takeout double

On balance it's clearly better to play it as minors and I do, but to say that there is no problem losing the immediate blackwood is not right.

To play one of 4♠/4N as minors over 2♠ and the other as blackwood is not stupid.

[TWO4BRIDGE]

helene_t, on 2011-July-25, 03:21, said:

Undiscussed I would take it as minors. But what is (2♠)-4♠? Some play as showing minors, too, but a better hand.

With prior agreement:
(2M) - ??

4M! = minors
4NT = Blackwood

Why give up Blackwood ?

This post has been edited by TWO4BRIDGE: 2011-July-25, 04:24

[VM1973]

Cyberyeti, on 2011-July-25, 01:35, said:

You really want to start with a double with AKQ to 10 A, x, x and defend 2 doubled ?

I believe that the chance of getting a 10-card suit is low enough that most players will go a lifetime without ever seeing one.

[Cyberyeti]

VM1973, on 2011-July-25, 06:35, said:

I believe that the chance of getting a 10-card suit is low enough that most players will go a lifetime without ever seeing one.

Nope, on average they see one, I've seen 3, 10-1-1-1, 10-2-1-0 and 10-3-0-0 and yet to get a decent result on any of them

[mck4711]

I am just reading "Preempts from A to Z" from Andersen/ Zenkel. They recommend the following:

2 maj: 2NT: 15-18, balanced, 2 stoppers
3NT: stopper, and tricks via a long, good suit
4C, 4D: strong 2-suiter with minor and other major
4 maj: strong 2-suiter minor

Having said this, 4NT would be free for Blackwood. But I am not sure if this considered to be standard.