[helium]

HI GUYS:)))


I was woundering if someone have the name for this convention, in norway we call it xy-nt but no others seem to know that name.


the convention i means is this:

1♣/♦/♥-pass-1♦/♥/♠-pass-1NT-
NOW:
2 ♣=ask opener to bid 2 ♦,and any bid after that is invitt to game but not forsing.
2 ♦is gameforse.
2 ♥/♠ for play

the reason we call it XY-nt is becouse its only after X(bid)-Y(bid)-1NT its on.


someone know what this is caled elsvere??


thx a lot kenneth

[xx1943]

helium, on Sep 8 2004, 04:12 PM, said:

HI GUYS:)))


I was woundering if someone have the name for this convention, in norway we call it xy-nt but no others seem to know that name.


the convention i means is this:

1♣/♦/♥-pass-1♦/♥/♠-pass-1NT-
NOW:
2 ♣=ask opener to bid 2 ♦,and any bid after that is invitt to game but not forsing.
2 ♦is gameforse.
2 ♥/♠ for play

the reason we call it XY-nt is becouse its only after X(bid)-Y(bid)-1NT its on.


someone know what this is caled elsvere??


thx a lot kenneth

Hi Kenneth

the convention is called XYZ. If you type in GOOGLE Bridge abd XYZ you'll get a lot of links.

i.e. XYZ

The convention is similar to "twoway-forcing-minor"

cheers

Al

[OSH]

XYZ after 1♣/♦/♥-pass-1♦/♥/♠-pass-1♥/♠, where Z means 1 in a suit
and XYNT in the case you posted.

I play the same way (3CL is to play).

[helium]

xx1943, on Sep 8 2004, 09:18 AM, said:

helium, on Sep 8 2004, 04:12 PM, said:

HI GUYS:)))


I was woundering if someone have the name for this convention, in norway we call it xy-nt but no others seem to know that name.


the convention i means is this:

1♣/♦/♥-pass-1♦/♥/♠-pass-1NT-
NOW:
2 ♣=ask opener to bid 2 ♦,and any bid after that is invitt to game but not forsing.
2 ♦is gameforse.
2 ♥/♠ for play

the reason we call it XY-nt is becouse its only after X(bid)-Y(bid)-1NT its on.


someone know what this is caled elsvere??


thx a lot kenneth

Hi Kenneth

the convention is called XYZ. If you type in GOOGLE Bridge abd XYZ you'll get a lot of links.

i.e. XYZ

The convention is similar to "twoway-forcing-minor"

cheers

Al

Hi NO sry sorry this is not what i meant, this is different xy and z could be ♥or♠, but i mean bid-bid -1 nt

[helium]

OSH, on Sep 8 2004, 09:24 AM, said:

XYZ after 1♣/♦/♥-pass-1♦/♥/♠-pass-1♥/♠, where Z means 1 in a suit
and XYNT in the case you posted.

I play the same way (3CL is to play).

yes same here 3♣is for play, but do u know the name???

[inquiry]

helium, on Sep 8 2004, 10:33 AM, said:

OSH, on Sep 8 2004, 09:24 AM, said:

XYZ after 1♣/♦/♥-pass-1♦/♥/♠-pass-1♥/♠, where Z means 1 in a suit
and XYNT in the case you posted.

I play the same way (3CL is to play).

yes same here 3♣is for play, but do u know the name???

Let me give you an improvement over 3♣ to play.

We agree that 1x-1y-1NT-2C is game invite? Yes.

Ok then, what is 1x-1y-1NT-2C-2somehthing-2NT? That is game invite in notrump. Simple when you think about it. So 1x-1y-1N-2N is not required for 3NT tries. Many players thus harnesh 2NT here to transfer to 3C. If responder wants to play exactly 3C he passes. This also increases the meaning of a vaiety of auctions, for instance if responder now rebids 3H after responding 1H, how is that different from 1x-1H-1NT-3H? You can set your own requirement, and how do these auctions differ from 1x-1H-1NT-2C/2D and then 3H rebid.

This also allows you to keep 3C to show some 5-5 hands with game going value without getting boggled down in having to use 2D first.

Ben

[whereagles]

The Keri structure is a very effective and precise way to continue bidding after

1x 1y
1NT

A structure with 2C/2D as inv/GF might be superior to Keri, but only if you sit down and discuss a lot sequences.

If you merely want to keep it simple, the dual 2C inv/2D GF structure is good enough, of course.

[OSH]

helium, on Sep 8 2004, 03:33 PM, said:

but do u know the name???

Maybe it wasn't clear, I call it XYNT, too.

[helium]

i i think the xy-nt system is exelent,speasaly for us who dont play 2/1 gameforse. but i need the name???

[han]

I believe it is sometimes called "2-way checkback".

However, XYZ is exactly the same thing, except that applies after more different situations (as said before). If you are already playing the convention, you might as well play XYZ, it works very well I think.

[helium]

i heasr its simular to 2 way check-back,but not quite the same since in 2wcb u can use it whenever 3 bids are made at the 1 level(the 3th bid dosent have to be nt)


but stll dont have the name for this convention

[Free]

This convention you describe also lives by the name "Two-way Checkback" or because many 2♣-bids which are a relay are called Stayman, "Two-way Checkback Stayman"

[1eyedjack]

Prefer YX-NT (ie, reverse XY-NT):
Use 2D as the first move on invite, and 2C as puppet to 2D as first move on some GF hands.

[helium]

i got this from raija today,


Two way checkback: Using both 2§ and 2¨ as artif rebids.

After any auction that begins with A-B-C (all 1 level bids)

Responder bids:
2§ (artif) = xfer to 2¨ - either weak with ¨s or any game try hand (never GF)
opener bids 2¨ almost always except with 18/19 or unusual hands
2¨ (artif) = Game forcing hand asking for more info (usually about support for Major)

Using this method - we never get confused as to where responder is headed although after using 2¨ - we may be going toward slam.

A 2NT bid by responder (from 1 level) = xfer to 3§ (even over 1NT)
2NT = one of 2 types of hands - weak with Clubs OR 5-5+ GF
Over the 3§ bid: Pass = weak with Clubs
All other bids = 5-5 GF - bid 2nd suit or rebid 1st suit when Clubs
Is the other suit.
This means that all secondary jumps by responder are natural (5-5) and invitational only.

ª Qxx ª Jx
© Kx © AQJxx
¨ Axxx ¨ xxx
§ AJxx ¨ Kxx

1§ 1©
1NT 2§* 2§= xfer to 2¨
2¨* 2© 2©=5 card suit NF but a try
3NT 3N= max (not 3 cards in ©) - can also bid 2N with min and 1©

ª Kxx ª AJ9xx
© Axx © KQJx
¨ Axx ¨ x
§ Qxxx § Kxx

1§ 1ª
1NT 2¨* 2¨ = artif GF
2ª 4ª 2ª = 3 card support - other bids natural.


ª AKxxx
© x
¨ Jx
§ AQxxx

Partner opens 1§ - you 1ª -- 1NT -- 2N* (xfer to 3§)
Then 3ª = ª and § 5-5 GF --- if other suit was ¨ or © - bid that suit at 3 level over 3§

PASSED HAND BIDDING:
Since responder can’t have a GF hand - we use 2§ as the same xfer to 2¨ with either weak hand w ¨s or game invit hand (somewhere).
A 2¨ rebid by responder = natural NF with 10-11 points and prob only 4 card Major.














thw symboles for the suits seems to not upear her, but §=♣,"=♦,@=♥,a=♠

[luke warm]

helium, on Sep 8 2004, 04:12 PM, said:

HI GUYS:)))


I was woundering if someone have the name for this convention, in norway we call it xy-nt but no others seem to know that name.


the convention i means is this:

1♣/♦/♥-pass-1♦/♥/♠-pass-1NT-
NOW:
2 ♣=ask opener to bid 2 ♦,and any bid after that is invitt to game but not forsing.
2 ♦is gameforse.
2 ♥/♠ for play

the reason we call it XY-nt is becouse its only after X(bid)-Y(bid)-1NT its on.


someone know what this is caled elsvere??


thx a lot kenneth

that's sorta what i play ... don't know any name except 2 way checkback stayman

[Gerben47]

I think it's called Relay Transfer (at least the 2♣ bid). The 2♦ bid is just forcing I guess

[skorchev]

Hi Ken,

I think also that the name of this convention is "2-way checkback", but imho in the regular "2-way checkback" 2♣ isn't forcing to 2♦ - it's just a forcing. But I prefer 2♣ to be forcing to 2♦. In Bulgaria this convention is played by high-level players.


Stefan

[Chamaco]

inquiry, on Sep 8 2004, 02:50 PM, said:

helium, on Sep 8 2004, 10:33 AM, said:

OSH, on Sep 8 2004, 09:24 AM, said:

XYZ after 1♣/♦/♥-pass-1♦/♥/♠-pass-1♥/♠, where Z means 1 in a suit
and XYNT in the case you posted.

I play the same way (3CL is to play).

yes same here 3♣is for play, but do u know the name???

Let me give you an improvement over 3♣ to play.

We agree that 1x-1y-1NT-2C is game invite? Yes.

Not really
Defining 2C as strictly invitational loses the option of signing off in 2 diamonds; there is of course the shortcoming of having to signoff in 3C when weak with clubs, but we cannot have it all :-)


In the original XYZ, responder's 2 clubs is a Puppet to 2 diamonds:
then, responder may pass with a weak hand with long diamonds, or, if he bids, he is invitational.

The convention was designed by Fred Hamilton this way to be able to respond "Walsh style" with a weakish hand; of course there is the slight drawback of having to play clubs at the 3 level, but it has seldom occurred so far.

So, to summarize:

1X:1Y:1Z/NT:?

2C: Puppet to 2 diamonds, then pass or invite
2D: "normal" GF hand (usually not slammish, but may be slammish balanced; it may also be the only bid to plan to show a slammish hand with clubs, as 3C wouyld be a weak signoff)
2X/2Y (e.g. weak rebid of own suit or raise of pard's suit)= natural, weak signoff to play

All other bids are strong. In particular, jump bids are natural picture bids with slammish hands with 1/2 suiters.

[helium]

Chamaco, on Sep 9 2004, 09:03 AM, said:

responder's 2 clubs is a Puppet to 2 diamonds:
then, responder may pass with a weak hand with long diamonds, or, if he bids, he is invitational.

this is how i play it too:)