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KOKISH assistance required

#1 User is offline   sceptic 

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Posted 2004-August-30, 11:53


Scoring: IMP


West North East South

 2    Pass  2    Pass
 4NT   Pass  5    Pass
 7    Pass  Pass  Pass
 


Hi all,

I bid the 7 diamonds, our partnership bid to 4nt using kokish, when we got there we discovered that we had a whole host of falws in our agreements, basically we did not know what to do next. I would appreciate comments on what we should be doing to reach the best contract, I think 7nt is a lay down

for anyones info 4nt shows 28-29 balanced in this sequence
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#2 User is offline   laughter 

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Posted 2004-August-30, 12:23

Playing Kokish, maybe you should consider the popular version 2H rebid shows balanced FG and unlimited.
If you play this style (unlimited rebid, opener plan to make strong bids to show extras)
the bidding can be:
2C 2D
2H 2S
2NT 3S(1)
4D(2) 4H(3)
5C(4) 5H(5)
5NT(6) 7NT(7)
Pass
Slam bidding requires some good partnership agreements:
(1) System on: 3S shows both minors.
(2) Agree D. A sensible agreement to have is when Super Strong hand make a forcing agreement, it is also an RKB ask.
(3) 1430. It shows 1 Keycard (both minor K should be counted)
(4) A Specific Suit Ask in C. Opener is interested in grand.
(5) You may play a raise to show QJ as you have denied the CK. Lacking such agreement, you can try 5H (the first step), promising third round C control.
(6) Obviously an invitation to grand.
(7) Holding an extra C plus the CJ, 7NT should have decent play.
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#3 User is offline   inquiry 

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Posted 2004-August-30, 12:46

sceptic, on Aug 30 2004, 01:53 PM, said:

I would appreciate comments on what we should be doing to reach the best contract, I think 7nt is a lay down

Double dummy, 7NT makes after any lead except a spade. However, try it on a spade lead, and if they play north for 4 spades and the heart king on anyohter lead (cash heart ACE, run all minor winners), then someone would probably raise a big eyebrow and wonder about cheating.

The spade lead breaks the communication for the squeeze. Now, 7NT is a better contract than 7D... becasue, if diamonds run, 7NT also makes, and if diamonds don't run, you have squeeze possibilities and if necessary, simply the heart hook to try. So the right place to be is 7nt... instead of 7D.

Ben
--Ben--

#4 User is offline   Free 

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Posted 2004-August-30, 14:06

I wonder why you play in 7 if you won't need your trumps to ruff losers... If there's no reason to play in trump (weak/short suit usually), then it's usually better to play NT <_<
"It may be rude to leave to go to the bathroom, but it's downright stupid to sit there and piss yourself" - blackshoe
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#5 User is offline   luke warm 

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Posted 2004-August-30, 17:46

i don't see anything wrong with the bidding... you can always bite the bullet (if you're bidding the grand anyway) and bid 7NT, based on the supposedly running diamonds and the rest of your monster
"Paul Krugman is a stupid person's idea of what a smart person sounds like." Newt Gingrich (paraphrased)
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#6 User is offline   han 

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Posted 2004-September-06, 09:53

What's wrong with the bidding is that east may have had a far worse hand. West bid the grand all by himself or herself, and is not good enough.

Over the Kokish variation where 2NT is balanced gameforcing there is much more room to have a cooperative auction to 7NT.
Please note: I am interested in boring, bog standard, 2/1.

- hrothgar
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#7 User is offline   luke warm 

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Posted 2004-September-06, 10:17

you are right, there are better ways to find this
"Paul Krugman is a stupid person's idea of what a smart person sounds like." Newt Gingrich (paraphrased)
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