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How do you make 6C here ? A Deep Finesse poser...

#21 User is offline   inquiry 

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Posted 2010-July-22, 15:05

Fluffy is right, I actually had the ruff a heart then play spades, just didn't write it down in post correctly. Actually the ruff doesn't matter which one..

So...
DA
HA
HK
H ruff
SK
SA
SQ.... now the play is forked... one with a ruff by EAST, one without... give it a try, south always wins out...
--Ben--

#22 User is offline   gnasher 

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Posted 2010-July-22, 15:45

Cyberyeti, on Jul 22 2010, 06:27 PM, said:

He didn't cover the wrinkles that come from E ruffing with 9 and then 10.

Personally I thought it was covered by this:

Fluffy said:

whenever he ruffs we overruff


followed by this:

Fluffy said:

get to dummy and cash last heart before playing the trump coup.

... that would still not be conclusive proof, before someone wants to explain that to me as well as if I was a 5 year-old. - gwnn
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#23 User is offline   Cyberyeti 

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Posted 2010-July-23, 03:22

gnasher, on Jul 22 2010, 04:45 PM, said:

Cyberyeti, on Jul 22 2010, 06:27 PM, said:

He didn't cover the wrinkles that come from E ruffing with 9 and then 10.

Personally I thought it was covered by this:

Fluffy said:

whenever he ruffs we overruff


followed by this:

Fluffy said:

get to dummy and cash last heart before playing the trump coup.

No, if you overruff the 3rd spade when ruffed with the 9, and then overruff the 4th spade when ruffed with the 10, you have a trump and a diamond loser, you have to discard the diamond when he ruffs with the 10, consuming his trump trick too.

Edit -

Threw this at my partner, he came up with a slight variation on the timing which I haven't found a hole in yet.

1. Win AD.
2. Heart ruff
3. Spade to queen.
4. Spade ace.
5. Ten of spades

If East doesn't ruff, discard diamond

6. AH, discard daimond.
7. KH, discard diamond.
8. Spade ruff.
9. AC.
10. Diamond ruff.
11. Low club endplays East.

It East ruffs, over-ruff

6. AC
7. AH, discard diamond.
8. KH, discard diamond.
9. Spade nine, discard diamond regardless of whether East ruffs again or not.

This in many ways is simpler still.
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#24 User is offline   gnasher 

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Posted 2010-July-23, 05:09

Perhaps we interpreted Fluffy's "whenever" differently. It seemed obvious to me that it meant "at whichever time", but maybe you interpeted it as meaning "every time".

Anyway, I wish I'd left Fluffy to fight his own battles.
... that would still not be conclusive proof, before someone wants to explain that to me as well as if I was a 5 year-old. - gwnn
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#25 User is offline   Cyberyeti 

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Posted 2010-July-23, 05:18

gnasher, on Jul 23 2010, 06:09 AM, said:

Perhaps we interpreted Fluffy's "whenever" differently.  It seemed obvious to me that it meant "at whichever time", but maybe you interpeted it as meaning "every time".

Anyway, I wish I'd left Fluffy to fight his own battles.

I think we did:

dictionary.com gives for whenever "at whatever time; at any time when", and the second of those was how I took it. I'm not clear if the first is any different or not.
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#26 User is offline   Fluffy 

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Posted 2010-July-23, 10:13

lol, if you really mean I am making a basic mistake double dummy with 4 tricks to go you ... know me quite well ;).
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#27 User is offline   Cyberyeti 

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Posted 2010-July-23, 11:49

Fluffy, on Jul 23 2010, 11:13 AM, said:

lol, if you really mean I am making a basic mistake double dummy with 4 tricks to go you ... know me quite well :).

No, I was assuming you'd get it right if it happened, it's just very easy to forget it is another possibility that could happen.

(Sorry had been doing a load of maths proofs all day and finding the odd cases is critical there)
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#28 User is offline   hanp 

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Posted 2010-July-23, 13:58

Who knew this double dummy problem would lead to such a discussion! :)
and the result can be plotted on a graph.
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