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Team Game hand it's a killer :)

#1 User is offline   pooltuna 

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Posted 2010-July-05, 08:04

Watching a team game where on this hand only EW are vulnerable you see this auction perpetrated on the general public.

West North East South
-      -       -     3♣
X     3♥     3♠    P
4♠    5♣    5♠    6♣
X    all pass

Scoring: IMP

West leads the ♠4 and East wins the A. The ♣2 is returned and South plays the A whereon West deposits the ♣K. Suddenly South keels over out of his chair,dead, and you, as the only kibitzer present, are thrust into the match to finish the hand. How do you continue?
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#2 User is offline   Hanoi5 

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Posted 2010-July-05, 08:36

There seems to be two paths:

1. Heart to the Queen and ruff two hearts, expenting the suit to be 4-3 and the King onside.

2. Heart to the Ace and ruff two hearts, expecting the King to be third.

I'll try the first one because of the vulnerable double, although the second one seems easier (?).

 wyman, on 2012-May-04, 09:48, said:

Also, he rates to not have a heart void when he leads the ♥3.


 rbforster, on 2012-May-20, 21:04, said:

Besides playing for fun, most people also like to play bridge to win


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#3 User is offline   hanp 

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Posted 2010-July-05, 08:41

I thought the question was between king-empty fourth onside and king-jack fifth onside. In the latter case you should go for the squeeze, in the former for the finesse.

Is KJxx KJxxx AJx K a 4S bid? I don't think so, but more so than KJxx Kxxx AJxx K. I think I might go for the squeeze but I think this is a really difficult hand.
and the result can be plotted on a graph.
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#4 User is offline   JLOL 

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Posted 2010-July-05, 09:13

Han,

Something to consider. There is a significant chance RHO will pitch a heart from Jxx, especially if we pitch 2 from dummy early on (very important!). It is unlikely he'll see any need to keep the additional one.

Not trying to insult RHO but he is clearly a very inexperienced player as he bid 3S NF then 5S (impossible), and also shifted to a trump in this position.

Since everything is pretty random anyways (I agree slight edge to the squeeze in a vacuum but it's basically pick em imo), that extra edge could be huge and will occur more frequently than people would like to think imo.
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#5 User is offline   hanp 

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Posted 2010-July-05, 09:18

Hmm I wasn't convinced that the squeeze was right but now you are saying that even when it is wrong, it will often be right? OK mark me down for the squeeze then.

I agree that we don't have to consider a Greek gift with the heart king on our right, because it would take a pretty good player to do so on purpose and it would be really strange for a good player to play a club back. Also, RHO having the heart king is really strange on the bidding.
and the result can be plotted on a graph.
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#6 User is offline   JLOL 

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Posted 2010-July-05, 09:19

hanp, on Jul 5 2010, 10:18 AM, said:

Hmm I wasn't convinced that the squeeze was right but now you are saying that even when it is wrong, it will often be right? OK mark me down for the squeeze then.

Yes I was agreeing with your line in case I wasn't clear...I just wanted you to feel happier about your choice!
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#7 User is offline   hanp 

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Posted 2010-July-05, 09:21

Yeah I was just spelling it out since this tough and interesting hand was actually posted in the BI forum!
and the result can be plotted on a graph.
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#8 User is offline   gwnn 

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Posted 2010-July-05, 09:29

X-)

next kib please
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#9 User is offline   pooltuna 

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Posted 2010-July-05, 10:02

JLOL, on Jul 5 2010, 10:13 AM, said:

Han,

Something to consider. There is a significant chance RHO will pitch a heart from Jxx, especially if we pitch 2 from dummy early on (very important!). It is unlikely he'll see any need to keep the additional one.

Not trying to insult RHO but he is clearly a very inexperienced player as he bid 3S NF then 5S (impossible), and also shifted to a trump in this position.

Since everything is pretty random anyways (I agree slight edge to the squeeze in a vacuum but it's basically pick em imo), that extra edge could be huge and will occur more frequently than people would like to think imo.

no offense taken

This was an early morning match (i.e. I was drinking my first cup of coffee) BTW our team won either 36-1 or 40-1 in an 8-board match.
"Tell me of your home world, Usul"
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"I learned long ago, never to wrestle with a pig. You get dirty, and besides, the pig likes it."

George Bernard Shaw
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#10 User is offline   hanp 

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Posted 2010-July-05, 10:48

The two bridge players that are here for dinner think spades are 5-5 and we should just play for king-fourth of hearts onside.
and the result can be plotted on a graph.
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#11 User is offline   cloa513 

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Posted 2010-July-05, 18:00

JLOL, on Jul 5 2010, 10:13 AM, said:

Han,

Something to consider. There is a significant chance RHO will pitch a heart from Jxx, especially if we pitch 2 from dummy early on (very important!). It is unlikely he'll see any need to keep the additional one.

Not trying to insult RHO but he is clearly a very inexperienced player as he bid 3S NF then 5S (impossible), and also shifted to a trump in this position.

Since everything is pretty random anyways (I agree slight edge to the squeeze in a vacuum but it's basically pick em imo), that extra edge could be huge and will occur more frequently than people would like to think imo.

Maybe RHO is more used to his partner bidding that double with hearts and diamonds rather than great spades and hearts. He has got the ace of diamonds and figures partner is void in clubs and south is void in diamonds
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#12 User is offline   JLOL 

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Posted 2010-July-05, 21:09

hanp, on Jul 5 2010, 11:48 AM, said:

The two bridge players that are here for dinner think spades are 5-5 and we should just play for king-fourth of hearts onside.

Really, RHO bidding 5S on ace fifth and out seems really unlikely also.

The actual layout actually kind of makes sense, shows at least why RHO thought a trump was safe, and RHO had a side card so that's why he bid with only 5 spades, and LHO had an extra spade so that's why he bid.. I guess.
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