[jillybean]

Scoring: IMP

1♦ : 1♠
2♦ : ?

---

uncontested auction

[P_Marlowe]

Hi,

2H or 3C.

If you play 2H as a 4 carder, the classic meaning, than you need to invent
sometimes a bid in a minor on the 3 level.

With kind regards
Marlowe

[vuroth]

3NT

[PhantomSac]

2H, 3N is premature as we could belong in spades, diamonds, or slam, especially when partner has a stiff club.

[ArtK78]

I play 3♣ here as extended new minor forcing (with 2♥ as nonforcing showing 5-4 or better), and that is the call that I would make.

[jdonn]

I used to think 2♥ should be NF here but now I'm definitely with the majority that forcing is better. You give opener so much more space (he has 3 useful bids below the level of 3♦ which he wouldn't have if we bid 3♣), and then our 3♣ bid itself become more descriptive as well. So I bid 2♥ on this hand.

[ONEferBRID]

After a same-suit minor rebid by Opener, "cheapest new suit forcing " ( 2♥! here ) and may be artificial -- Responder ostensibly showing 5+ cards ♠ .

[neilkaz]

jdonn, on Mar 8 2010, 01:50 PM, said:

I used to think 2♥ should be NF here but now I'm definitely with the majority that forcing is better. You give opener so much more space (he has 3 useful bids below the level of 3♦ which he wouldn't have if we bid 3♣), and then our 3♣ bid itself become more descriptive as well. So I bid 2♥ on this hand.

I agree with Josh here and note that his cat is much fatter than mine.

[jillybean]

Thanks, I like the idea of using 2♥ forcing here.

If 2♥ can be short, what would partner bid over 2♥ holding something like

x,xxxx,KQxxxx,AK

[blackshoe]

I suspect opener should raise hearts with that hand, notwithstanding that responder might not have four hearts.

[helene_t]

I think that hands needs to bid 3♥. After all, 2♥ might be natural

Maybe responder can then bid 3♠ and opener now 3NT. It is a little bit of guesswork, though. Opener's 3♠ bid could also be the way to show a GF hand with long spades, assuming that 3♠ as responder's second turn would not be forcing.

I am assuming that 2♥ is "in principle" natural. But opener will not need to bid 4♥ to show a maximum with four hearts. This is because once opener shows 4-card heart support, you are in a game force.

[jillybean]

And after 3♥ here, 3nt, 3♠, ♦ ?

Scoring: IMP

1♦ : 1♠
2♦ : 2♥
3♥ : ?

---

[vuroth]

I think 3NT is right. This should let partner know that our heart bid wasn't a 4 card suit, wouldn't it?

[P_Marlowe]

jillybean, on Mar 9 2010, 10:28 AM, said:

Thanks, I like the idea of using 2♥ forcing here.

If 2♥ can be short, what would partner bid over 2♥ holding something like

x,xxxx,KQxxxx,AK

3D.

Basically it depends, if you want to force with this hand to game,
I would not, so 3D it would be for me.
The alternative to 3D would be 2NT, if you want to sell your 4 card
suit as stopper.
If responder has 5-4 in the majors and a game force, he will bid
again.

If you want to play 2H as artifcial (sensible), than you should also
discuss with your p, what 3H instead of 2H showes, and what a
delayed 3H bid showes.

Assuming you play NMF, my suggestion would be, to play it in the
same way.

With kind regards
Marlowe

[jillybean]

vuroth, on Mar 9 2010, 08:45 AM, said:

I think 3NT is right. This should let partner know that our heart bid wasn't a 4 card suit, wouldn't it?

Yes it would deny 4♥ however with our ♣ holding, we also need to hope that partner hasn't opened on
K,Qxxx,AQJxxx,xx

[jdonn]

Typically with 4 hearts opener would raise to 3♥. However with x xxxx KQxxxx AK like you give it would probably be a good judgment call to bid 2NT instead.

[Echognome]

I think it should at least be mentioned, BIL notwithstanding, that if you play 2♥ here as forcing, then you are stuck with the 5-4 or 5-5 majors hand and less than invitational values. A solution around that is to play Reverse Flannery over 1m openings (which also helps over certain over calls like a 2♣ response).

Given that 2♥ is forcing, then I would bid:

1♦ - 1♠;
2♦ - 2♥;
3♥ - 3♠;
3NT

Yes you may play in a 5-2, but that may be the best contract opposite partner's 2=4=5=2 hand with no club stopper.

[jdonn]

2452???

[Fluffy]

after 2♥ partner is almost forced to raise with any 4 carder.

If partner raises 2♥ to 3♥ your bid is 3NT, yes, you might lack a club stopper, but after a major has been raised and its not gonna be a good spot your only way to show it is to bid 3NT ASAP. You don't know if 3NT is good or not, but you do know 4♥ is silly.

[Echognome]

jdonn, on Mar 9 2010, 09:01 AM, said:

2452???

Your bid on xx AQxx AQJTx xx after 1♦ - 1♠?

But fine 2=4=6=1 would have been better to the point. Or do you think that's not possible either?