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Forcing pass: am example from malmo

#1 User is offline   Chamaco 

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Posted 2004-July-01, 10:40

Scoring: IMP


Italy vs Czech rep,
NS = Forth/Volhejn
EW= Bocchi Duboin

W N E S
p 1NT 2 2NT
4 p p 4NT
X 5 p p
5 p p 6
p p X al pass


I 'd like to use this hand as one example for high level forcing pass.
I will appreciate any comments on my considerations below :P

Thanks a lot !! :D


For the bidding, I will assume 1NT by N is 10-12 balanced, and that South's 2NT is some sort of xfer to clubs (with the optoion of showing a second suit later).

After West's 5 , using the "standard" agreement for forcing pass (please correct me if I am wrong ! :unsure: ), N should:

- double with wasted values
- double with a minimum hand and low ODR
- bid on with high ODR
- pass when in doubt (no defensive potential and a fair ODR)
- pass then pull pard's double as a stronger slam try (unlikely by a limited hand here which has bid 1NT). Here it would be a Grand Slam Try, since simply bidding would commit to small slam.


Question 1
If the above is true (1NT shows 10-12 bal, 2Nt shows clubs, and the forcing pass agreements follow the abovementioned list), I disagree with N's pass.
Kx in spades is wasted values and strongly suggest doubling.
Do you agree ?

Question 2
Suppose that the same auction occurred but rather than holding
Hand 1 (the original)
K7842KQ2KJT63
North holds instead
Hand 2
xxKxxKQ2KJT63

In this situation, no wastage in opps suit suggest not doubling.
Yet it is unclear whether 6 clubs makes or not.
I would pass, given the best offensive hand I can have.

Question 3
Suppose that the same auction occurred but rather than holding Hand 2

North holds instead
Hand 3
xxKxxAxxKT632

In this situation, I have still no wastage in opps suit.
Yet I have a minimum hand (10 hcp), which suggests that outbidding 5 should not work.
I would double despite no defensive tricks.

Question 4
Suppose that the same auction occurred but rather than holding Hand 2

North holds instead
Hand 4
xxxKxKQ2KJT63

This hand is exactly like hand 2 but with one extra card in opps suit.
This suggests to double, even if it is a small card (Law of total tricks anyone ? - PS Notice how I did not call it the Law withg uppercase letters not to hurt anyone's feeling LOL).
"Bridge is like dance: technique's important but what really matters is not to step on partner's feet !"
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#2 User is offline   Free 

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Posted 2004-July-01, 12:04

Hmmm i think this is a bad example for forcing pass sequences, since nobody knows what pair has the most HCP... ok, south and east know, but west and north don't know... 2NT might be weak, and 2 doesn't tell much about strength.
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#3 User is offline   inquiry 

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Posted 2004-July-01, 12:40

Free, on Jul 1 2004, 02:04 PM, said:

Hmmm i think this is a bad example for forcing pass sequences, since nobody knows what pair has the most HCP... ok, south and east know, but west and north don't know... 2NT might be weak, and 2 doesn't tell much about strength.

For this to be a forcing pass hand, you will have to assume that either 2NT was game force, or maybe that NS are vul and EW are not (then 4NT would be to play game, not potentially as a sacrafice).

Given that north is limited to (12-14) pts or 10-12 balanced for his 1NT, his hand is very offensively oriented for an auction where partner starts with game forcing reply showing , and very poor defensively. So if 2NT was game force and showed 's, bidding is fouled, as North should bid 5 immediately over 4.

Now, let's pretemd we bid 5 and this is passed to WEST who bids 5. (That is, I am changing your auction too....

    
W      N      E      S
p      1NT    2    2NT
4    5     p     P
5   ?

I don't like changing your auction, but FREE was right about the one you gave.

Question 1.
Now with this hand, I would double 5. I have already shown a weak offensive hand with my first 5 bid (first shot at forcing pass, which I refused), now this double separates my type of offensive hand. For my 5 offensive hand, I have some reasonable defense. If I had more of an offensive hand for the current auction, I would make a forcing pass here.

Question 2. I would still bid 5, but now over 5, I would make a forcing pass

Question 3: I would still bid 5 and then double 5

Question 4: Now I would pass over 4, planning on pulling to 5 as a slam invite. Since I am limited to 12 hcp, partner will realize that I may not (at this NT range, clearly do not), have a control.

Ben
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#4 User is offline   Chamaco 

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Posted 2004-July-01, 18:11

Free, on Jul 1 2004, 06:04 PM, said:

Hmmm i think this is a bad example for forcing pass sequences,

I was suspecting this :P
That's why I am looking out to collect good examples somewhere ! :D
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