[fachiru]

Scoring: MP

---

1♠ - all Pass
Made 4 easily.
What do you think went wrong?

[aguahombre]

Too easy to look at both hands, afterward, and result.

I agree with 1S rather than 2C, and probably would not respond with the other hand. Oh, well....next hand might be better.

[jdonn]

Responder. Even if you don't respond light in general he has the KQ together in one suit, the ten of partner's suit, and a 5 card major where there may be a fit. Passing the opening bid is criminal.

[billw55]

jdonn, on Nov 17 2009, 01:29 PM, said:

Responder. Even if you don't respond light in general he has the KQ together in one suit, the ten of partner's suit, and a 5 card major where there may be a fit. Passing the opening bid is criminal.

Interesting, I would agree when playing with a partner whose opening bids are sound, respond 1NT. But with a partner who opens any trashy 11 count (there seem to be many), would you feel the same?

[aguahombre]

jdonn, on Nov 17 2009, 11:29 AM, said:

Passing the opening bid is criminal.

Careful, we might get moved to the LAWS Forum by Blue or Black. Passing 1S is certainly more questionable than the 1S opening bid, but with a good attorney, I could get off.

[jdonn]

billw55, on Nov 17 2009, 01:41 PM, said:

jdonn, on Nov 17 2009, 01:29 PM, said:

Responder. Even if you don't respond light in general he has the KQ together in one suit, the ten of partner's suit, and a 5 card major where there may be a fit. Passing the opening bid is criminal.

Interesting, I would agree when playing with a partner whose opening bids are sound, respond 1NT. But with a partner who opens any trashy 11 count (there seem to be many), would you feel the same?

I'd feel even more strongly in fact. You want to respond if the opponents have game (or a partscore) as well.

[Phil]

I would respond, but I would also open 2♣.

[kfay]

What makes N's hand worse than: 10 Qxxxx Qxxx Qxx? I'm sure that only WW would call this example better. I'd always respond on the N hand.

I also wouldn't open 2♣. But maybe I need to open 2♣ more liberally? Generally I do it only with game basically in hand. But then again, my partners would all respond 1NT so I haven't felt slighted at all by this.

[gnasher]

If I opened this 2C, I'd be planning to rebid 2NT. Insisting on game with this is excessive.

[pooltuna]

fachiru, on Nov 17 2009, 01:19 PM, said:

Scoring: MP

---

1♠ - all Pass
Made 4 easily.
What do you think went wrong?

You didn't open 2♣

[ArtK78]

Not even close to a 2♣ opening bid.

Responder owes opener a bid. Opener could be 5-5 in the majors. Now it doesn't take too much to make a game. For example:

Axxxx
Axxxx
xx
A

or

Axxxx
Axxxx
Ax
x

You may not bid the game, but at least you will get to hearts instead of spades.

[rhm]

jdonn, on Nov 17 2009, 01:29 PM, said:

Responder. Even if you don't respond light in general he has the KQ together in one suit, the ten of partner's suit, and a 5 card major where there may be a fit. Passing the opening bid is criminal.

I am such a criminal, who does not believe that it is winning Bridge in the long run to respond with sub minimum values on a misfit, particularly when partner opens a 5 card major.

I also do not understand why people set up such extreme requirements for a 2♣ opening, at least when holding a major one-suiter.
Could it be that you respond on nothing because you set up such extreme requirements for opening 2♣?
With a long major there is little wrong by agreeing that a simple suit rebid after a second negative is not forcing

Rainer Herrmann

[rhm]

ArtK78, on Nov 17 2009, 02:31 PM, said:

Not even close to a 2♣ opening bid.

Responder owes opener a bid.  Opener could be 5-5 in the majors.  Now it doesn't take too much to make a game.  For example:

Axxxx
Axxxx
xx
A

or

Axxxx
Axxxx
Ax
x

You may not bid the game, but at least you will get to hearts instead of spades.

For some Christmas arrives on every board, at least until dummy comes down.
Others take a far more realistic view to this game and go plus instead of minus.

Rainer Herrmann

[Phil]

rhm, on Nov 17 2009, 02:36 PM, said:

ArtK78, on Nov 17 2009, 02:31 PM, said:

Not even close to a 2♣ opening bid.

Responder owes opener a bid.  Opener could be 5-5 in the majors.  Now it doesn't take too much to make a game.  For example:

Axxxx
Axxxx
xx
A

or

Axxxx
Axxxx
Ax
x

You may not bid the game, but at least you will get to hearts instead of spades.

For some Christmas arrives on every board, at least until dummy comes down.
Others take a far more realistic view to this game and go plus instead of minus.

Rainer Herrmann

And for others that don't believe in Santa Claus, they try to be the grinch with the opponents, and occasional deliver the gift of KQxxx to partner.

[jdonn]

rhm, on Nov 17 2009, 02:32 PM, said:

jdonn, on Nov 17 2009, 01:29 PM, said:

Responder. Even if you don't respond light in general he has the KQ together in one suit, the ten of partner's suit, and a 5 card major where there may be a fit. Passing the opening bid is criminal.

I am such a criminal, who does not believe that it is winning Bridge in the long run to respond with sub minimum values on a misfit, particularly when partner opens a 5 card major.

It's not a misfit yet! You could still have a fit in any suit at all, partner has only taken one bid so far.

rhm, on Nov 17 2009, 02:36 PM, said:

ArtK78, on Nov 17 2009, 02:31 PM, said:

Not even close to a 2♣ opening bid.

Responder owes opener a bid.  Opener could be 5-5 in the majors.  Now it doesn't take too much to make a game.  For example:

Axxxx
Axxxx
xx
A

or

Axxxx
Axxxx
Ax
x

You may not bid the game, but at least you will get to hearts instead of spades.

For some Christmas arrives on every board, at least until dummy comes down.
Others take a far more realistic view to this game and go plus instead of minus.

His examples were quite realistic. If he wanted to be 'unrealistic' he could give partner Axxxx AKxxx AJx - so that you struggle along in 1♠ with a cold grand slam, and opposite a mere 16 count too.

[neilkaz]

Good thread here. I prefer to open this 2♣ which is not GF for me after a dbl negative response.

However, this is a dead min for me and if PD opens 1♠ I won't say a word in criticism, and I trust he won't say a word when I respond 1NT, with what is also a min, but having a bit too much potential to pass.

[Jlall]

lol

[gnasher]

Jlall, on Nov 17 2009, 11:24 PM, said:

lol

Indeed, but exactly what are you laughing at? There are a lot of people out there who are waiting for you to express an opinion so that they can agree with it. In the circumstances, non-specific ridicule isn't particularly helpful.

[Jlall]

gnasher, on Nov 17 2009, 06:58 PM, said:

There are a lot of people out there who are waiting for you to express an opinion so that they can agree with it.

haha that's funny

[Vilgan]

Be interesting to see a calculation done with 1000+ hands where responder has that hand and opener has a 1S opener and responder bids a forcing NT. My inclination would have been to pass as responder. I like hearing a red suit, and don't want to hear black suits or 2NT out of partner. Responding works great in this case, but I wonder if its truly the percentage action.