[jillybean]

Scoring: MP

2♦ (P) 2♥ (P)
?

---

I checked, the minors are correct

[gwnn]

you can bid 4♣ showing a 3 card fit, shortness and a maximum

[pooltuna]

jillybean, on Sep 11 2009, 11:05 AM, said:

Scoring: MP

2♦ (P) 2♥ (P)
?

---

I checked, the minors are correct

and no child abuse?

3♥ you only need to show support not bid game

[jillybean]

gwnn, on Sep 11 2009, 09:08 AM, said:

you can bid 4♣ showing a 3 card fit, shortness and a maximum

And because the opps haven't bid you are not concerned that partner may have a weakish hand in ♥'s with no diamond tolerance? 4♣ is a spunky bid, I like it.

[gwnn]

I am not responsible for partner's misbids, not even if they're a minor

[aguahombre]

Like 4C, but am not familiar with weak two in diamonds, and whether responder goes out of his way to find a major suit fit with questonable values to compensate. Even with that lack of knowledge, I don't think I care on this hand.

[jillybean]

jillybean, on Sep 11 2009, 09:28 AM, said:

gwnn, on Sep 11 2009, 09:08 AM, said:

you can bid 4♣ showing a 3 card fit, shortness and a maximum

And because the opps haven't bid you are not concerned that partner may have a weakish hand in ♥'s with no diamond tolerance? 4♣ is a spunky bid, I like it.

When I asked my mentor this, he said;

Partner should not have a weakish hand in hearts – ‘rescuing’ a weak 2 bid before it is doubled with a weak hand is rarely a good idea. And there should be some diamond tolerance (obviously not as strong as in this hand), unless partner is sure the hand will not be played in diamonds, ie sure he will bid 3H if partner rebids 3D.

[kenrexford]

There is a slight problem with the splinter, IMO.

Consider two possible hands for Opener:

1. xxx-Kxx-KQJxxx-x
2. xxx-Qxx-AKxxxx-x

On the latter, Opener has a huge hand for partner. A trump honor to possibly solidify the honors there, a stiff, and two quicks in diamonds.

On the former, actual hand, Opener has the same solidification in hearts, and the same stiff, but the diamond contribution is very hesitant.

Give partner even a void in diamonds, and the former creates two quick pitches for, say, Axx in spades. The latter does not help much.

I would reserve the splinter for this type of situation -- top-heavy diamonds.

However, it is easier for me, because I play that a 2NT rebid (2♦-P-2M-P-2NT) shows a "good raise", whereas 3M shows a "bad raise." This allows more space to further explore contracts when the major will be raised.

That said, a reasonable method here would be for a LTTC to ask for the raise type, if discussed and agreed. Thus:

2♦-P-2♥-P-4♣ would show either type. 4♦ LTTC by Responder would ask Opener to bid on if he has the pure tricks scenario (xxx-Qxx-AKxxxx-x) but to sign off with the fit-dependent type (xxx-Kxx-KQJxxx-x). This works fine, as Responder won't care and will know anyway when he has a diamond honor. This won't help, though, in the one situation when the stiff is immediately below the agreed major (2♦-P-2♠-P-4♥). In that situation, though, Opener could bid 4♦ to show the specific hand of stiff heart and fit-dependent hearts but 4♥ with the stiff heart and diamond quicks.

Of course, you might then ask about AQJxxx. Figure that one out yourself.

[ONEferBRID]

jillybean, on Sep 11 2009, 11:05 AM, said:

Scoring: MP

2♦ (P) 2♥ (P)
?

---

2D - 2H
??
2NT! = x x x tripleton or A x, K x, Q x honor-doubleton
3H = honor-tripleton
if none of the above, then
2S = Sp feature ( A or K; if agreed may also be Q )
3C = Cl feature,( etc )
3D = none of the above
3NT= A K Q x x x

[kenrexford]

ONEferBRID, on Sep 11 2009, 06:48 PM, said:

jillybean, on Sep 11 2009, 11:05 AM, said:

Scoring: MP

2♦ (P) 2♥ (P)
?

---

2D - 2H
??
2NT! = x x x tripleton or A x, K x, Q x honor-doubleton
3H = honor-tripleton
if none of the above, then
2S = Sp feature ( A or K; if agreed may also be Q )
3C = Cl feature,( etc )
3D = none of the above
3NT= A K Q x x x

That works, too. You could still have splinters for the wildly great hands. With the hesitant, fit-dependent splinters, you would bid 2NT or 3M as appropriate and then partner could make some relay asking for a possible stiff.

2♦-2♥-4♣ = power splinter (4♦ LTTC asking for trump honor)
2♦-2♥-3♥-3♠(relay)-4♣ = Hxx, fit-dependent splinter
2♦-2♥-2NT-3♣(relay)-4♣ = xxx, fit-dependent splinter
2♦-2♥-2NT-3♣(relay)-3♦(Hx)-3♠(relay)-4♣ = Hx, fit-dependent splinter
2♦-2♥-2NT-3♣(relay)-3♥(Hx, power splinter somewhere)-3♠(where)-4♣ = Hx, power splinter

This way, Opener could show:

Hx with a stiff and AKxxxx in diamonds
Hx with a stiff and KQJxxx in diamonds
xxx with a stiff and KQJxxx in diamonds
Hxx with a stiff and AKxxxx in diamonds
Hxx with a stiff and KQJxxx in diamonds
xxx with a stiff and AKxxxx in diamonds

[cherdanno]

jillybean, on Sep 11 2009, 12:51 PM, said:

jillybean, on Sep 11 2009, 09:28 AM, said:

gwnn, on Sep 11 2009, 09:08 AM, said:

you can bid 4♣ showing a 3 card fit, shortness and a maximum

And because the opps haven't bid you are not concerned that partner may have a weakish hand in ♥'s with no diamond tolerance? 4♣ is a spunky bid, I like it.

When I asked my mentor this, he said;

Partner should not have a weakish hand in hearts – ‘rescuing’ a weak 2 bid before it is doubled with a weak hand is rarely a good idea. And there should be some diamond tolerance (obviously not as strong as in this hand), unless partner is sure the hand will not be played in diamonds, ie sure he will bid 3H if partner rebids 3D.

I would say it more simply. 2♥ is forcing with game interest.
Diamond tolerance is likely but not promised. With a 23 count and a singleton diamond you can't pass...

[ONEferBRID]

Ken... how would it go with a stiff Spade ?

That was the easy question. Now, how would it work for
2♦ - 2♠ ?

[nigel_k]

I agree with Cherdanno - 2♥ is forcing with game interest. There may even be hands where partner bids 2♥ and then passes 3♦ with a void, eg AQxx AQxxx - Kxxx

[kenrexford]

ONEferBRID, on Sep 11 2009, 09:22 PM, said:

Ken... how would it go with a stiff Spade ?

That was the easy question. Now, how would it work for
2♦ - 2♠ ?

Let's see. Stiff spade first.

2♦-2♥-?

2NT = Hx or xxx. 3♣ asks. 3♦ Hx; 3♥ asks for stiff; 3♠ stiff spade. 3♠ direct after 3♣ fit-dependent stiff. 3♥ after 3♣ power splinter xxx support; 3♠ asks; 3NT stiff spade.

3♥ = Hxx; 3♠ asks; 3NT stiff spade.

3♠ = immediate power splinter.

Next issue. Spades.

2♦-2♠-?

Same basic structure. 4-bids power. 3♠ Hxx; 3NT asks. 2NT with the relays and asks.

[aguahombre]

wow...that is neat but gave this old guy a headache. think I will stick with mini roman 2D so I don't have to think.

but it sure seems like it works.

[ONEferBRID]

aguahombre, on Sep 11 2009, 11:43 PM, said:

wow...that is neat but gave this old guy a headache....... 

but it sure seems like it works.

Ditto !