[pirate22]

you hold A--AKQJ9864--void--AQ93--- and drop 3 cl and make it 3 hts

so you are either 1/8/v/4 or 1/9/v/3 im not dreaming up hands,
So what are we opening if its 2cl-next person interferes with spades(2sp)(2d)
partner has a problem, if he passes your bid?or if pard bids 3d over 2sp, or x 2d--what is your rebid? is it a question of blasting-to add to your misery
same hand and opp does not bid pard will bid 2d (auto) and listen to what you have to say,or he bids 3 d- over opps 2 d again your bid,

This leading up to how to handle big big hands when you require specific information when some answers come in ill open up the subject more.
I expect there will be some derisory comments,but over the years,i have monitored lots of unwieldy hands and formulated a formula to cope with them,
and practice what i preach with a good success rate.if you have some of these type hands and you were to high to low--game only small slam -1 or missed a grand.put it to the test,when i expand the subject regards

[Jlall]

It's weird, my eyes just unfocus. Cool trick!

[mtvesuvius]

Yay, two 12 card hands.

[pirate22]

apols all was ammending and my fav clients got in well done and my apols

[manudude03]

I would just blast 6 and don't worry about 7. You may want to check out this link on theory of disclosure vs concealment. It's not exactly the same topic but you can't really expect the opps to ever be silent when you have this kind of hand.

I wouldn't worry about getting to 7 unless you have very specific agreements. In a pickup partnership, one option might be to open 1H, jump to 3D and then rebid 6H. Partner will at least know his ♦K is gold and raise if he has it.

[pirate22]

this is not about pick up partners---------regular partners,pairs and teams -what are your agreements--------one shld have a plan/system

[jdonn]

Hooked on phonics did not work for me.

[manudude03]

Dunno about you, but I build my systems around hands which come up more than once a year. Like I said, I will just blast 6H even in my regular partnerships. Most of the time, the opps will be at 4S or 5D, or higher when it comes back round to you. Who knows, they might bid 6S when 6H was never making.

EDIT: I mentioned another (probably LOLable) way here

[gwnn]

I want to live,
I want to give
I've been a miner
for a heart of gold.
It's these expressions
I never give
That keep me searching
for a heart of gold
And I'm getting old.
Keeps me searching
for a heart of gold
And I'm getting old.

I've been to Hollywood
I've been to Redwood
I crossed the ocean
for a heart of gold
I've been in my mind,
it's such a fine line
That keeps me searching
for a heart of gold
And I'm getting old.
Keeps me searching
for a heart of gold
And I'm getting old.

Keep me searching
for a heart of gold
You keep me searching
for a heart of gold
And I'm growing old.
I've been a miner
for a heart of gold.

[655321]

pirate22, on Jun 25 2009, 05:02 PM, said:

I expect there will be some derisory comments,but over the years,i have monitored lots of unwieldy hands and formulated a formula to cope with them,
and practice what i preach with a good success rate.

That's OK, this is the forums. You only need to recommend a weird method, and claim never to have had a bad result with it. This is a good system, because it avoids those boring things like actual proofs, or actual winning of bridge tournaments!

[neilkaz]

It would be nice if you posted hands and used suit symbols as it makes for easier reading and you may get more replies.

Anyhow, perhaps some pairs have methods to open 2♣, jump rebid 3♥ setting trump and then to ask for a ♣ control and then find that it is the K and then try 7♥. But they may still encounter preemption.

For me, I open 2♣ then blast to 6♥ if the opps interfere.

[mtvesuvius]

gwnn, on Jun 25 2009, 08:03 PM, said:

I want to live,
I want to give
I've been a miner
for a heart of gold.
It's these expressions
I never give
That keep me searching
for a heart of gold
And I'm getting old.
Keeps me searching
for a heart of gold
And I'm getting old.

I've been to Hollywood
I've been to Redwood
I crossed the ocean
for a heart of gold
I've been in my mind,
it's such a fine line
That keeps me searching
for a heart of gold
And I'm getting old.
Keeps me searching
for a heart of gold
And I'm getting old.

Keep me searching
for a heart of gold
You keep me searching
for a heart of gold
And I'm growing old.
I've been a miner
for a heart of gold.

- Neil Young.

[pirate22]

wonderfull poetry--------------``agree someone commented the odd hand,why have a sys for the odd hand,that is not why i raised the point.

there are 4 ways to approach 1(blast away) 6 hts
2 (open 2cl and with a positive or 2d auto,how do you find out what pard has)
3 (open 4n/t asking to bid specific ace-then what )
4 open 2c! with "modified norman responses\",and it also applies if opener has a two suiter,or a single suiter or a 3 suiter

responses are An ace= 1 point--------An King =1/2 point but stepped,as follows

2d=0,2h=1k,2sp=1 ace,2n/t=1 ace&1k,3cl=2k,3d=3k,3h=2 points(either2A or 1A or 4 k's )if opener cannot work what 3 hts is, Then take up BINGO-do not try modified norman,with pick up games,success rate about 85% on the hand given 7 hts cold despite, sp interference,responses remain same ,my pard responded 3hts,
apply this formuale to future hands with your fav pard .regards

[aguahombre]

neilkaz, on Jun 25 2009, 09:16 PM, said:

Anyhow, perhaps some pairs have methods to open 2♣, jump rebid 3♥ setting trump and then to ask for a ♣ control and then find that it is the K and then try 7♥. But they may still encounter preemption.

For me, I open 2♣ then blast to 6♥ if the opps interfere.

Yup, that's us. And after any interference we cannot set trump and demand outside description. Anyone have a way to do it after low-level interference and pass showing values, with double showing bust in partner's hand? Certainly if 2d or 2H comes back around to the big hand, a jump to the 3-level or a simple 3 of a minor can still activate. but how about if the interference is 2S and opener's suit is 3hearts, etc?

[manudude03]

pirate22, on Jul 3 2009, 03:21 PM, said:

... 4 open 2c! with "modified norman responses\",and it also applies if opener has a two suiter,or a single suiter or a 3 suiter

responses are  An ace= 1 point--------An King =1/2 point but stepped,as follows

2d=0,2h=1k,2sp=1 ace,2n/t=1 ace&1k,3cl=2k,3d=3k,3h=2 points(either2A or 1A or 4 k's )if opener cannot work what 3 hts is, Then take up BINGO-do not try modified norman,with pick up games,success rate about 85% on the hand given 7 hts cold despite, sp interference,responses remain same ,my pard responded 3hts,
apply this formuale to future hands with your fav pard .regards

Really not a fan of this, seems to waste an awful lot of space on the normal 2C hands, not to mention you seem to have ignored the biggest problem

[jdonn]

Awesome, great system for hands with solid 8 card suits that just need a king or two! Now to see how it functions on hands that require a search for a fit...

[pirate22]

forget single suit hands -i did write it works for 2 suiters and 3 suiters--we did get low level interference on the bagger they came in 2 sp over 2cl--ok agree with a single suit one can be bounced -i.e. 2cl--4 spades sys off,but percentage wise, opps are curious so do not usually interfere until later regards

[manudude03]

pirate22, on Jul 3 2009, 05:40 PM, said:

forget single suit hands -i did write it works for 2 suiters and 3 suiters--we did get low level interference on the bagger they came in 2 sp over 2cl--ok agree with a single suit one can be bounced -i.e. 2cl--4 spades sys off,but percentage wise, opps are curious so do not usually interfere until later regards

wait til later? LOL you do realise thats the worst of both worlds, right?. Let the opps exchange enough information and let them know enough to penalise you if its right.

[pirate22]

Manudude 33 the object of the forum,is to present ones views,and idea's,to enhance ones games,in no way,am i asking Grandma to suck eggs,give me your report,in a months time of hands that you have missed/or made,and gone down in,ill do the same,and hands that i have kibbitzed to boot---it will prove interesting,and any other persons that have rock crushers
regards

[Phil]

I can't wait to see this.

Is a week too long?

I'll sign the ***** Non-disclosure agreement if you need me to.