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Good Spade Fit

#1 User is offline   kgr 

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Posted 2009-May-13, 10:39

Scoring: MP

1♠-(2♥)-??
- What do you bid now?
- What would 4♦ be in your system (After opps overcall, can you splinter in another suit?)
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#2 User is offline   whereagles 

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Posted 2009-May-13, 11:08

I bid now 4♠ + 5♠.

4♦ would be a fit bid (spades+diamond side suit). This particular hand could use that gadget if I felt like it :P
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#3 User is offline   Free 

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Posted 2009-May-13, 11:10

4♦ should be fit jump, 4♥ should be splinter.

I bid 4♦ since I want partner to take a good decision if opps go to 5♣ or 5♥.
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#4 User is offline   dake50 

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Posted 2009-May-13, 14:31

3D fit-non-jump. I'd be happy if partner quit over 3H fearing 4H on and 4S fails.

Actually I have transfer-advances here so 3C ->D and S-raise next.
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#5 User is offline   rogerclee 

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Posted 2009-May-13, 14:33

I play 4♦ is fitted, but I would bid 4♠ anyway.
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#6 User is offline   kfay 

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Posted 2009-May-13, 15:02

dake50, on May 13 2009, 03:31 PM, said:

3D fit-non-jump. I'd be happy if partner quit over 3H fearing 4H on and 4S fails.

Playing fit non-jumps here seems almost unheard of to me.

I'd bid 4♦ for sure. What's the rush to 4♠? We might have slam on! Furthermore if and when they bid 5♥ nobody's going to know what to do when my partner or I bids 5♠.
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#7 User is offline   mtvesuvius 

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Posted 2009-May-13, 15:05

4♦ now... I'll await developments on later.
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#8 User is offline   cherdanno 

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Posted 2009-May-13, 15:07

Never make a fit bid when we have spades and they have hearts. Well, almost never, but this hand doesn't quite qualify as an exception. 4D is much more likely to help them find 5H or 5C, than to help us decide whether to bid 5S over 5H.
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#9 User is offline   jdonn 

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Posted 2009-May-13, 15:10

cherdanno, on May 13 2009, 04:07 PM, said:

Never make a fit bid when we have spades and they have hearts. Well, almost never, but this hand doesn't quite qualify as an exception. 4D is much more likely to help them find 5H or 5C, than to help us decide whether to bid 5S over 5H.

Hehe I agree with the general point, but I was going to post this hand is a perfect exception. We are just so long in diamonds and have so much offense that I feel the need to involve partner.
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#10 User is offline   skjaeran 

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Posted 2009-May-13, 15:35

4♦, really seems like the hand for it.
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#11 User is offline   gnasher 

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Posted 2009-May-13, 15:49

4♦. Whenever I decide to bid game instead of making a fit bid, it doesn't work, so I've stopped doing it.
... that would still not be conclusive proof, before someone wants to explain that to me as well as if I was a 5 year-old. - gwnn
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#12 User is offline   hanp 

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Posted 2009-May-13, 16:03

4D for me too. The question is not what we are going to do over 5H. It is what we are going to do over 6H.
and the result can be plotted on a graph.
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#13 User is offline   the hog 

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Posted 2009-May-13, 21:02

4D fit jump. Good hand for it.
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#14 User is offline   Phil 

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Posted 2009-May-13, 23:02

4♦. I'd rather have one less diamond for this bid since I'm not sure I'll respect a double of 5♥. To me, involving partner is paramount, so 4♠ is out.
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#15 User is offline   Echognome 

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Posted 2009-May-13, 23:44

Phil, on May 13 2009, 09:02 PM, said:

4♦. I'd rather have one less diamond for this bid since I'm not sure I'll respect a double of 5♥. To me, involving partner is paramount, so 4♠ is out.

Well when I'm partner of course!

Just to show I respect Phil's judgment, I would bid 4♦ as well.
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#16 User is offline   cherdanno 

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Posted 2009-May-13, 23:47

hanp, on May 13 2009, 05:03 PM, said:

4D for me too. The question is not what we are going to do over 5H. It is what we are going to do over 6H.

If you bid 4D, certainly. I plan to get doubled in 5S :unsure:
"Are you saying that LTC merits a more respectful dismissal?"
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#17 User is offline   downagain 

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Posted 2009-May-14, 02:26

I was in the same situation and decided to bid 4♦.. Good we discussed these kind of jumps a few rounds before :). I thought it was the ideal hand to make this kind of descriptive bid.

Now the bidding continued:

1♠ - (2♥) - 4♦ - (4♠)
5♥ - (Pass) - ?

What do you do now? Does 5♥ deny a club control? Does it deny a first round ♣ control? Does it ask for a ♥ control? Or is it just a general slam try?

(Sorry for hijacking your topic.. but think it's quite related)
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#18 User is offline   whereagles 

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Posted 2009-May-14, 03:24

I think this should deny a club control, but I don't really know if pard means it as such.

What I do know is my hand is a min fit-jump and my controls are a bit lacking.

Thus, 5♠.
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#19 User is offline   kfay 

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Posted 2009-May-14, 08:01

downagain, on May 14 2009, 03:26 AM, said:

I was in the same situation and decided to bid 4♦.. Good we discussed these kind of jumps a few rounds before :). I thought it was the ideal hand to make this kind of descriptive bid.

Now the bidding continued:

1♠ - (2♥) - 4♦ - (4♠)
5♥ - (Pass) - ?

What do you do now? Does 5♥ deny a club control? Does it deny a first round ♣ control? Does it ask for a ♥ control? Or is it just a general slam try?

(Sorry for hijacking your topic.. but think it's quite related)

I have 0 keycards and partner cuebid the suit I'm void in.
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#20 User is offline   kgr 

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Posted 2009-May-14, 12:18

Thanks aal for the answers.
I was only given this hand and was asked what I would bid.
Additional questions:
- Is it correct that experts - after opps overcall - don't splinter in a 3th suit? Jumps are fit then?
- What after 1H-(1S)? What after 1H-(1S)-Jac2NT-(pas)-3C; is 3C still singleton?
- Only the actual hand both sides can make 5 and both sides only go down in 6 after a specific lead. We have to lead ♦ against 6H and opps have to lead ♣ against 6S.
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