[paulhar]

Playing 2/1 game forcing, you open 1H, partner bids 2C, you bid 2D.

What is the difference between partner's 2H, 3H, and 4H calls?

For those of you that inevitably are going to reply that I should post this in the beginner's section, the reason I'm posting this is because I have seen such a disparity of opinion among decent players and authors and want to get a feel for what people play today.

[rbforster]

1H-2C
2D-?

2H is normally shows 3 card support and agrees hearts.
3H might be a splinter in support of diamonds (?)
4H sounds like a picture bid, values in hearts and clubs only (with heart support)

[655321]

paulhar, on Mar 1 2009, 01:40 PM, said:

For those of you that inevitably are going to reply that I should post this in the beginner's section, the reason I'm posting this is because I have seen such a disparity of opinion among decent players and authors and want to get a feel for what people play today.

If only there was a forum for discussing SAYC and 2/1...

[FrancesHinden]

paulhar, on Mar 1 2009, 06:40 PM, said:

For those of you that inevitably are going to reply that I should post this in the beginner's section, the reason I'm posting this is because I have seen such a disparity of opinion among decent players and authors and want to get a feel for what people play today.

How about posting it in the 2/1 forum?

Anyway, as with virtually all of this type of question, the answer is "it depends on your agreement". As you seem to be asking for what people play, rather than what anyone thinks may be standard, I'll tell you what I play:

2D by opener wasn't necessarily natural, but that doesn't really change the meaning of the responder's heart bids

2H (step 1) = artificial relay, asking opener to describe his hand further
2NT = 3-card heart support

3H = 4-card support, sets trumps. Over this we play Rodwell (3S = non-serious slam try, or extra values with no cue bid; 3NT = spade cue; 4m = cue bid in a serious slam try)
4H = 2425 with good clubs but no side suit A or K.

Compared to many people's methods, this is really just a swap of 2H and 2NT, as 2NT is commonly used as a "I don't know what to bid" bid. We prefer to use the cheaper 2H call for that.

[hanp]

I play 2D shows a minimum and says nothing about diamonds, 2H is a relay, 3H is a (strong) picture bid and 4H is to play.

[kenrexford]

Rob F, on Mar 1 2009, 02:13 PM, said:

1H-2C
2D-?

2H is normally shows 3 card support and agrees hearts.
3H might be a splinter in support of diamonds (?)
4H sounds like a picture bid, values in hearts and clubs only (with heart support)

Pretty much same for me:

2♥ = 3+ support, hearts agreed
3♥ = splinter for diamonds, but I promise three of the top four clubs, no spade control (Q or xx at best), and my stiff heart is not the Ace or King.
4♥ = Picture heart raise (for me, no 1st/2nd-round controls in spades or diamonds, three of the top four clubs, two of the top three hearts)

I'd also add that my 2♦ was also not necessaruily a true suit, although it is not "completely" artificial. I would bid 2♦ with balanced hands, with two or three diamonds, but typically with at least the diamond King (if balanced).

[peachy]

1H-2C-2D-
I play 2H shows three hearts; 3H shows three or more hearts and slam interest (I don't splinter in partner's suit); 4H shows 5+ good clubs and good heart support. Lack of direct forcing heart raise (Jacoby 2NT for example) is telling. Some folks have agreements on when not to Jacoby 2NT (or whatever the forcing raise).

[awm]

I'd assume that:

(1) 2♥ is kind of a relay. It is usually three-card support but occasionally two or four. Clubs can easily be four cards in length (maybe three!) and need not be a strong suit. This doesn't necessarily set hearts as trump; it is still possible to wind up in notrump or a minor suit fit. Partner is requested to pattern out.

(2) 3♥ is a slam try with 4+♥ and 5+♣. This is usually a very strong hand, but one better described by this sequence than by starting with jacoby (i.e. a club fit and/or honor could be key to slam here). This sequence requests a cuebid.

(3) 4♥ is a "picture bid." This will have 3+♥ and 5+♣ with strength concentrated in the suits. Normally this denies even a second-round control outside (i.e. something like xx KQx xx AQJTxx).

Of course it's possible to agree that 3♥ is a splinter, but I wouldn't assume this and don't have such an agreement with any of my regular partners.

[P_Marlowe]

Hi,

coming from an SAYC / 2/1 style rebidding minor non forcing

#2H - not necessarily 3 card support
#3H - slam interest
#4H - no slam interest

The only issue is with 2H, it depends if 2NT over 2D pormises
a spade stopper or not, and if 2S is FSF or natural.

With kind regards
Marlowe

[Codo]

2 ♥ 3 Hearts invitational
3 ♥ 3 Hearts, (maybe 4) Slam interessted
4♥ 3 Hearts to play opposite 12-14.

[whereagles]

paulhar, on Mar 1 2009, 06:40 PM, said:

1. What is the difference between partner's 2H, 3H, and 4H calls?

2. I have seen such a disparity of opinion among decent players and authors and want to get a feel for what people play today.

1. 100% matter of agreement. It's the kind of stuff you never discuss with pard, which latter happens at table and you have NO CLUE what pard's thinking of

2. I play something that fits into the "shape/strenght before the rest" lore:

1♥ 2♣
2♦ ...?

2♥ = honest 3 card support, slammish. Opener now bids

3♥: min hand, no slam interest. Gives room for responder to make one final try.
4♥: picture bid (min, all vales in hearts/clubs, no side aces or singletons)
Suit/NT: slam interest, values (2NT = trump values)
Jump suit: undiscussed (can be splinter or something...)

3♥ = honest 3 card support, but no slam interest. Natural follow-ups, with opener bidding controls with slam interest of his own.

4♥ = picture bid (min, all values in hearts and diamonds, no side aces or singletons)

[Fluffy]

We had this discussion not too long ago, sorry but I am too lazy to find it.

I remember ken suggested then that 3♥ could be used as splinter, some liked the idea.


I think 4♥ is a picture bid, and not fast arrival.

[the hog]

1H-2C
2D-?

2H can be a doubleton H and is just a waiting bid. generally shows a minimum hand
3H agrees H and is a strong raise. Invokes serious/frivolous
4H is a picture bid, values in hearts and clubs only (with heart support)