[H_KARLUK]

Scoring: IMP

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            P  1♠
  2♥  P  P  3♣
  P    ?

General approach : 2/1

[Fluffy]

3♥ so partner knows we had a penalty pass, next raise in clubs.

Not highly describit, but I can't think of anything else describig, maybe 4♥.

[Hairy_Scot]

Fluffy, on Jan 8 2009, 07:36 AM, said:

3♥ so partner knows we had a penalty pass, next raise in clubs.

Not highly describit, but I can't think of anything else describig, maybe 4♥.

Not sure about 3♥. Could be taken as asking for stoppers?

4♥ will almost certainly get 4♠ from partner.

I would think game is probably there but 3NT could be a disaster so I am torn between 4♣ or 5♣.

Does partner's 3♣ show strong or intermediate values?

[mikeh]

Partner's decision to reopen with 3♣ suggests 5+ clubs and 5+ spades. He may be very short in hearts, but might have done this with a 5=2=1=2 or 5=1=2=5 on which he was not willing to sell out and couldn't risk a 3♦ call by you if he were to double.. note that this is far more likely to be when he is 5215. 5224 is possible, but unlikely...many such hands would either pass or double.

I think we probably have game here, and while 4♠ on a 5-1 fit may be playable, that game rates to be in clubs.

For now, I content myself with 3♥. It is wrong to consider this to be 'stopper ask'. Consider... we passed over 2♥... and now, after a simple reopening call, we can commit to 3N provided partner has a stopper? That has to be low percentage.

Anyway, 3♥ is unambiguously forcing, and partner is expected to make an intelligent, descriptive bid.. there is nothing, in principle, preventing him from bidding 3N if that is the best call (altho I would then expect to go down in 3N after a diamond lead). I am pulling 3N to 4♣, bidding 4♣ over 3♠ and raising 4♣ to game.

[Benoit35]

I'm not optimistic about 3NT. Partner may have a 5-5 without that much strength (not much above minimum) and may simply wish for us to pass or correct to spades. If that's the case, I don't want to be in 3NT.

Or partner is 5-4 with extra strength, in which case we have the combined points for 3NT. We could find out by bidding 3♥, but then this will wake up the defense and we're likely to get dinged by the diamonds. Quantum physics meets bridge - if we look at our chances if making 3NT, we may very well alter said chances.

Therefore, I'd simply bid 4♣ to invite a club game.

Given this, I don't see the use of bidding hearts on the way to reaching 4 or 5♣. Furthermore, there might be an advantage in concealing our heart length (and, indirectly, our spade shortness) from the opposition prior to the opening lead in a club contract.

[P_Marlowe]

3NT.

3H asks primary for a heart stopper. (*)

It depends of course, what you expect for a neg. X,
some require at least 8HCP, and what you require
for a 3C reopening.

But there is another issue with 3H, unless p finds
a 3S bid, he will by pass 3NT.
And even if 3H showes heart values, removing partner
fear about a open heart suit, 3H would not show the
diamond stopper, but I stopp diamonds as well.

(*) If you say that 3H showes hearts, than 3H asks for
a diamond stopper.

With kind regards
Marlowe

[Fluffy]

P_Marlowe, on Jan 8 2009, 12:58 PM, said:

3H asks primary for a heart stopper. (*)

Uwe, in my view, once we passed 2♥, the only strong hands left that we have are penalty passes of 2♥, that's what 3♥ shows.

[hrothgar]

Partner has a good hand with both Black suits.
Partner rates to have a stiff Heart, so my HCP's are working.
I have two bullets and four card trump support for partner's clubs.

I'm game forcing game... I think that slam is more likely than going down in 5♣.

3♥ seems reasonable. However, I wish I could show my Diamond control...

[P_Marlowe]

Fluffy, on Jan 8 2009, 09:07 AM, said:

P_Marlowe, on Jan 8 2009, 12:58 PM, said:

3H asks primary for a heart stopper. (*)

Uwe, in my view, once we passed 2♥, the only strong hands left that we have are penalty passes of 2♥, that's what 3♥ shows.

I can live with that.

But than 3H primarily asks for a diamond stopper,
because the bid promises a heart stopper.
3H forces to game, and without a fit for partner,
NT is the game, one needs to investigate.

3H may be bid with slam ambitions in mind, but
partner needs to know, what answer interests me
most, because he has to find a bid.

I hate it, if partner throws a cue on me, and I have
to guess, what is it, that interests him most.
I have a nice p, but he likes to cue the opponents suit,
even if he has better alternatives.

With kind regards
Marlowe

PS: 3H is not the only bid, which would show a penalty
pass, 4S would also show one.

[Apollo81]

We certainly should bid game, and possibly have slam. 3♥ for now.

[P_Marlowe]

hrothgar, on Jan 8 2009, 09:44 AM, said:

Partner has a good hand with both Black suits.
Partner rates to have a stiff Heart, so my HCP's are working.
I have two bullets and four card trump support for partner's clubs.

I'm game forcing game...  I think that slam is more likely than going down in 5♣. 

3♥ seems reasonable.  However, I wish I could show my Diamond control...

Do you play 2NT as some kind of Good-Bad in this
sitiuation?

We do, and for us openers 3C would be limited,
since we play reverse good-bad, i.e. the weaker
hand bid directly.

With kind regards
Marlowe

[whereagles]

If I wanted to torture partner, I'd try a 4♥ BLUHMER bid

Under normal circumstances, 3♥ + some nr of clubs should be enough (and I'm not stopping below 5).

[H_KARLUK]

Scoring: IMP

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            P  1♠
  2♥  P  P  3♣
  P    ?

General approach : 2/1

[mike777]

[H_KARLUK]

Sorry Mike777, I respect yr point of view. I need to assure you that my words now are neither sarcasm nor gloating.

Anyway, frankly speaking, were you really ready to get risk of your double passed and switched to penalty by partner?

Say they are down 1. I think given layout 5♣ is not a bad option. For sure also some may accept 2/3N by passed partner.

[mike777]

H_KARLUK, on Jan 9 2009, 12:49 AM, said:

Sorry Mike777, I respect yr point of view. I need to assure you that my words now are neither sarcasm nor gloating.

Anyway, frankly speaking, were you really ready to get risk of your double passed and switched to penalty by partner?

Say they are down 1. I think given layout 5♣ is not a bad option. For sure also some may accept 2/3N by passed partner.

yes

dbl no problem yet.

I dbl on much less.

[Fluffy]

H_KARLUK, on Jan 9 2009, 05:49 AM, said:

I think given layout 5♣ is not a bad option. For sure also some may accept 2/3N by passed partner.

Give partner ♥KJ10xx instead of one those aces and then tell me.

[FrancesHinden]

whereagles, on Jan 8 2009, 06:53 PM, said:

If I wanted to torture partner, I'd try a 4♥ BLUHMER bid

I would expect 4H to end the auction (if a game bid can possibly be natural, it is)

[Mosene]

I admit I had thoughts of 6 clubs. But for sure 5 clubs. I have no interest in 3nt. Partner is bidding to the 3 level with not a peep from me yet - and I have 2 aces, 4 clubs and long hearts indicating partner has really at most 1. I guess 3 hearts is the right next bid - but blasting to 5 clubs works for me too. If I knew partner had 5 clubs I might just blast to 6 - not sure how I can know that though.

[whereagles]

FrancesHinden, on Jan 9 2009, 11:08 AM, said:

whereagles, on Jan 8 2009, 06:53 PM, said:

If I wanted to torture partner, I'd try a 4♥ BLUHMER bid

I would expect 4H to end the auction (if a game bid can possibly be natural, it is)

4♥ natural?? Well...

But maybe I make it