[H_KARLUK]

Scoring: MP

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P   1♣   1♦   1♥
2♦   P    P    3♦
P   3♠    P    4♥   
P   ?

[mike777]

H_KARLUK, on Jan 1 2009, 12:43 PM, said:

Scoring: MP

---

P   1♣   1♦   1♥
2♦   P    P    3♦
P   3♠    P    4♥   
P   ?

I guess I got to pass to answer your question but I object to 3s...prefer 3nt.
I think pard would reopen with dbl if they want to hear spades.

[whereagles]

Why didn't I double 2♦?

Anyway, if partner is reliable, I just about have one of the best possible hand in this auction. 4NT, followed by some grand slam try if all the keys are there.

If pard is unreliable... pass.

[gnasher]

whereagles, on Jan 1 2009, 07:28 PM, said:

Why didn't I double 2♦?

Perhaps it would have been a support double?

[jdonn]

Definitely 4NT, I am just shy of having been good enough to bid 2♠ over 2♦, and my hand is useful for slam. I'm a little worried about hearts being good enough, but partner has insisted on them so I'll take the chance.

[H_KARLUK]

Scoring: MP

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P   1♣   1♦   1♥
2♦   P    P    3♦
P   3♠    P    4♥   
P   4NT   p   5♦
P   6♥ ap

[mike777]

Wow partner has a 4loser hand and I opened the bidding. I guess he thinks I open on junk.

[Codo]

partner is a bean counter. He sees 12 HCPs so he bids game. He did not see a zillion playing tricks opposite an opening bid.

[jdonn]

mike777, on Jan 1 2009, 04:32 PM, said:

Wow partner has a 4loser hand and I opened the bidding. I guess he thinks I open on junk.

Or he thought that you can easily have an opening hand without the AK of diamonds or A of hearts, seeing as he is missing 16 other high card points?

Codo, on Jan 1 2009, 04:58 PM, said:

partner is a bean counter. He sees 12 HCPs so he bids game. He did not see a zillion playing tricks opposite an opening bid.

He didn't just bid game. He cuebid then bid game. I think he counted his beans very well. Better than you did in fact since he has 13 HCPs.

[mike777]

As I said it may have helped if I rebid 3nt not 3s but in anycase wow partner must assume I bid alot on 11 pointhands.

I would have tried 4d again over 3nt....

[jdonn]

mike777, on Jan 1 2009, 05:47 PM, said:

As I said it may have helped if I rebid 3nt not 3s but in anycase wow partner must assume I bid alot on 11 pointhands.

What do you mean 11 point hands? He could think you have any or all of AJxx x Jxx AKQJx.

[TimG]

codo said:

partner is a bean counter. He sees 12 HCPs so he bids game. He did not see a zillion playing tricks opposite an opening bid.

I don't see a zillion tricks opposite Axxx x Jxx AKJxx, a fairly normal opening bid which seems consistent with the auction.

[mike777]

jdonn, on Jan 1 2009, 05:52 PM, said:

mike777, on Jan 1 2009, 05:47 PM, said:

As I said it may have helped if I rebid 3nt not 3s  but in anycase wow partner must assume I bid alot on 11 pointhands.

What do you mean 11 point hands? He could think you have any or all of AJxx x Jxx AKQJx.

I must admit I would rebid 3s not 3nt with your examples but ok...in any case I still vote for 4d by strong hand.

[jdonn]

mike777, on Jan 1 2009, 06:53 PM, said:

jdonn, on Jan 1 2009, 05:52 PM, said:

mike777, on Jan 1 2009, 05:47 PM, said:

As I said it may have helped if I rebid 3nt not 3s  but in anycase wow partner must assume I bid alot on 11 pointhands.

What do you mean 11 point hands? He could think you have any or all of AJxx x Jxx AKQJx.

I must admit I might would rebid 3s not 3nt with your examples but ok...in any case I still vote for 4d by strong hand. If I thought of your example hand at the table, I did not, I guess I would rebid 5H.....

If you would have bid 3NT instead of 3♠ then fine, but you are focused on the wrong thing. Jxx xx KJx AKJxx would bid 3NT. There are tons of hands you can have where partner can't risk the 5 level.

[mike777]

I must admit over 3nt I would rebid 4d. I got a 4 loser hand.......

[jdonn]

You don't have diamond control, and there are only so many times you can cuebid them before partner will expect one. In fact you haven't even agreed a suit, what if partner thinks you are showing club support? I don't have answers to all these questions, but you might want to consider that the auction might sound differently to partner than you mean it.

Whatever happened to KISS?

[mike777]

jdonn, on Jan 1 2009, 07:01 PM, said:

You don't have diamond control, and there are only so many times you can cuebid them before partner will expect one. In fact you haven't even agreed a suit, what if partner thinks you are showing club support? I don't have answers to all these questions, but you might want to consider that the auction might sound differently to partner than you mean it.

Whatever happened to KISS?

ok you convinced me....assuming I do not open sound...then 4nt it is...given I open lite with many partners I guess 4nt makes sense, ty.

[Fluffy]

4NT doesn't solve our problems so much, look what kind of gamdle on the actual hand you had to make when partner showed 1 key card, with ♥QJ10 missing he bid slam anyway.

I would like to bid 4♠ instead of 4NT and leave the initiative to partner.

[Codo]

TimG, on Jan 2 2009, 07:53 AM, said:

codo said:

partner is a bean counter. He sees 12 HCPs so he bids game. He did not see a zillion playing tricks opposite an opening bid.

I don't see a zillion tricks opposite Axxx x Jxx AKJxx, a fairly normal opening bid which seems consistent with the auction.

As far as I know AJxx,A,Axx,xxxxx is an opening bid too and seems to be consistent with the bidding. There maybe is a tool to find out whether your well constructed hand or my example is nearer to the reality.

Hey, maybe partner opened with Jxxx,x,KJxx,AKQJx and the defence against 4 Heart starts with Diamond ace, Diamond ruff and two more missing aces?
Hopefully they do not double...

[Codo]

jdonn, on Jan 2 2009, 07:00 AM, said:

Codo, on Jan 1 2009, 04:58 PM, said:

partner is a bean counter. He sees 12 HCPs so he bids game. He did not see a zillion playing tricks opposite an opening bid.

He didn't just bid game. He cuebid then bid game. I think he counted his beans very well. Better than you did in fact since he has 13 HCPs.

4 HEart was a real masterbid, which makes 81% so far passing. What is your guess: Do we all overlook the strength of openers hand, or may we all expect a worse hand from responder?

He cuebid and bid 4 Hearts. What makes you sure, that he has so many playing tricks?
I would bet that many BBF members would bid a hand with lets say:
Kxx,AKJTxx,Qx,xx with 1 Heart 3 Diamond and 4 Heart. And this hand is obviously much weaker then the example hand.