BBO Discussion Forums: Balancing with a balanced hand - BBO Discussion Forums

Jump to content

Page 1 of 1
  • You cannot start a new topic
  • You cannot reply to this topic

Balancing with a balanced hand

Poll: 1C-2S-P-P; you have 3334 19-count: (38 member(s) have cast votes)

1C-2S-P-P; you have 3334 19-count:

  1. Pass (8 votes [21.05%])

    Percentage of vote: 21.05%

  2. Double (8 votes [21.05%])

    Percentage of vote: 21.05%

  3. 2NT (21 votes [55.26%])

    Percentage of vote: 55.26%

  4. Depends on form of scoring (how?) (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

  5. This is why I play mexican 2D (1 votes [2.63%])

    Percentage of vote: 2.63%

Vote Guests cannot vote

#1 User is offline   awm 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 8,655
  • Joined: 2005-February-09
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Zurich, Switzerland

Posted 2008-November-16, 13:15

Suppose you hold a 3334 19-count, say:

♠Kxx ♥AJx ♦AQx ♣KQxx

You open a natural 1♣ and LHO bids 2♠, which passes back to you. What's your plan?
Adam W. Meyerson
a.k.a. Appeal Without Merit
0

#2 User is offline   pclayton 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 9,151
  • Joined: 2003-June-11
  • Location:Southern California

Posted 2008-November-16, 13:35

2N shows this for me. Not crazy about it with a single stop and no trick source.
"Phil" on BBO
0

#3 User is offline   whereagles 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 14,900
  • Joined: 2004-May-11
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Portugal
  • Interests:Everything!

Posted 2008-November-16, 13:41

2NT seems perfectly normal, even without the stopper.
0

#4 User is offline   jdonn 

  • - - T98765432 AQT8
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 15,085
  • Joined: 2005-June-23
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Las Vegas, NV

Posted 2008-November-16, 16:06

I would pass for sure on such a featureless hand. Even with game values I think game would go down often.
Please let me know about any questions or interest or bug reports about GIB.
0

#5 User is offline   the hog 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 10,728
  • Joined: 2003-March-07
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Laos
  • Interests:Wagner and Bridge

Posted 2008-November-17, 00:08

Pass. It wouldn't surprise me at all if 2NT were whacked and went for a number. You really don't have a source of tricks on this hand.
"The King of Hearts a broadsword bears, the Queen of Hearts a rose." W. H. Auden.
0

#6 User is offline   Codo 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 6,373
  • Joined: 2003-March-15
  • Location:Hamburg, Germany
  • Interests:games and sports, esp. bridge,chess and (beach-)volleyball

Posted 2008-November-17, 02:15

Who should be able to bid a pen. double against our possible 2 NT now?
But the risk for a zillion undoubled undertricks is bad enough, anyway.

But okay, I bid 2 NT. Maybe pd surprises me with Kxxxxx in diamonds or Axxxx in clubs and we make even 3 NT while you are defending and hope for 100.
Kind Regards

Roland

Sanity Check: Failure (Fluffy)
More system is not the answer...
0

#7 User is offline   cherdano 

  • 5555
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 9,520
  • Joined: 2003-September-04
  • Gender:Male

Posted 2008-November-17, 10:56

Codo, on Nov 17 2008, 02:15 AM, said:

Who should be able to bid a pen. double against our possible 2 NT now?

RHO with a decent hand and spade shortness?

Btw, aren't we all bidding 2N with 4♦/6♣ hands here?
The easiest way to count losers is to line up the people who talk about loser count, and count them. -Kieran Dyke
0

#8 User is offline   FrancesHinden 

  • Limit bidder
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 8,482
  • Joined: 2004-November-02
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:England
  • Interests:Bridge, classical music, skiing... but I spend more time earning a living than doing any of those

Posted 2008-November-17, 11:10

2NT is certainly natural, but I don't think it shows a 3334 19-count, rather (roughly) a hand that was going to rebid 3NT with a spade stop.
0

#9 User is offline   Gerben42 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 5,577
  • Joined: 2005-March-01
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Erlangen, Germany
  • Interests:Astronomy, Mathematics
    Nuclear power

Posted 2008-November-17, 11:46

Probably unhappy pass. Partner couldn't bid with a ♠ shortness, that spells trouble.
Two wrongs don't make a right, but three lefts do!
My Bridge Systems Page

BC Kultcamp Rieneck
0

#10 User is offline   cherdano 

  • 5555
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 9,520
  • Joined: 2003-September-04
  • Gender:Male

Posted 2008-November-17, 12:04

FrancesHinden, on Nov 17 2008, 11:10 AM, said:

2NT is certainly natural, but I don't think it shows a 3334 19-count, rather (roughly) a hand that was going to rebid 3NT with a spade stop.

Hmm true.
The easiest way to count losers is to line up the people who talk about loser count, and count them. -Kieran Dyke
0

#11 User is offline   han 

  • Under bidder
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 11,797
  • Joined: 2004-July-25
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Amsterdam, the Netherlands

Posted 2008-November-17, 12:10

Impossible to choose between pass and double without knowing the vulnerability (and less important, form of scoring). Would double when all white, would pass when all red.
Please note: I am interested in boring, bog standard, 2/1.

- hrothgar
0

#12 User is offline   FrancesHinden 

  • Limit bidder
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 8,482
  • Joined: 2004-November-02
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:England
  • Interests:Bridge, classical music, skiing... but I spend more time earning a living than doing any of those

Posted 2008-November-17, 13:01

FrancesHinden, on Nov 17 2008, 05:10 PM, said:

2NT is certainly natural, but I don't think it shows a 3334 19-count, rather (roughly) a hand that was going to rebid 3NT with a spade stop.

Actually that's not quite true, that hand probably just bids 3NT now.
A similar hand but not quite as strong.
0

#13 User is offline   Codo 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 6,373
  • Joined: 2003-March-15
  • Location:Hamburg, Germany
  • Interests:games and sports, esp. bridge,chess and (beach-)volleyball

Posted 2008-November-18, 01:44

cherdano, on Nov 18 2008, 01:56 AM, said:

Codo, on Nov 17 2008, 02:15 AM, said:

Who should be able to bid a pen. double against our possible 2 NT now?

RHO with a decent hand and spade shortness?

Btw, aren't we all bidding 2N with 4♦/6♣ hands here?

Do you belive that rho looks at x,KQxx,KJxx,AJxx? Or what is the worst holding he is doubling with?

BTW for me 2 NT had shown a 6/4 hand or similar, but I doubt that this is played without discussion.
Kind Regards

Roland

Sanity Check: Failure (Fluffy)
More system is not the answer...
0

#14 User is offline   hatchett 

  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Full Members
  • Posts: 589
  • Joined: 2005-November-02
  • Location:Moldova

Posted 2008-November-18, 03:51

2NT although it seems to look ugly always seems to work well in these situations. Sometimes you have a game on and with a weak hand with a long suit partner can run to three of that suit. I'm not sure why some expect to be doubled for a number, since you hold nearly half the deck, and LHO has shown a weak hand it rates to be your hand, and even when it's right to double most of the time RHO won't be in a position to wield the axe.

I don't understand double that is asking to play in 3 of a suit when 2NT/3NT is right and I don't see any advantage in it compared to 2NT since we can hardly expect partner to be passing for penalties.
0

#15 User is offline   rogerclee 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 3,214
  • Joined: 2007-December-16
  • Location:Pasadena, CA

Posted 2008-November-18, 04:52

2N shows 18-19 balanced to me or the equivalent. I really hate passing out 2S with that hand, partner can easily have 7-8 points, and could have some 9 counts.

Also totally disagree that 2N would show 4-6, I really feel strongly that you have to balance with this hand.
0

#16 User is offline   andy_h 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 1,962
  • Joined: 2007-September-14
  • Location:Australia
  • Interests:The Universe, Traveling, Squash, and Scandinavia.

Posted 2008-November-18, 20:58

Passing this out is kinda tough. With random scattered values from partner might see us make 8 or 9 tricks on power and hooks against rho. So an inkling and a bit unhappy 2NT for me.
- Andy -

We are all connected to each other biologically, to the Earth chemically, and to the rest of the universe atomically.
We're in the universe, and the universe is in us.
0

#17 User is offline   de_sweetie 

  • Pip
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 2
  • Joined: 2008-October-30
  • Gender:Female

Posted 2008-November-19, 13:42

unwillingly pass this hand.. :o
pessimistic whether there is game or just nothing.
People see the result, GOD sees the process, and I am only a human..
0
Page 1 of 1
  • You cannot start a new topic
  • You cannot reply to this topic

2 User(s) are reading this topic
0 members, 2 guests, 0 anonymous users