[helene_t]

1NT-2♣* stayman
3♥*-4♣** 5-card hearts, undiscussed
4♦*- undiscussed

[Hilver]

3♥  should be 5-card hearts and a maximum NT-opening bid.
2♣  is weak. limit or strong.
So 3♥ is the agreed trump suit and 4♣ a control bid.

[Walddk]

In my view it depends on methods. Do you play four-way transfers? If yes, 4♣ now is a cue bid for hearts since responder bid Stayman instead of a transfer to clubs. If not, 4♣ is natural, slammy. We must also ask: what would a jump to 3♣ over 1NT be?

Depending on the agreements I outlined above, 4♦ would then be a cue bid, either for hearts or clubs.

Roland

[helene_t]

good point, Roland. Actually, strong hands with clubs have to start with Stayman in our methods (a minor suit transfer followed by 4♠ would be ambigous since the minor suit would not be disclosed). P held 6 clubs and 4 spades.

Maybe over 3♥, 3♠ would now agree hearts while 4m should be natural? Or maybe we should change our methods.

[han]

4C is clubs, with slam interest in hearts responder can bid 3S. As responder has not shown interest in hearts, that suit is now not in the picture (unless opener bid 4H which would perhaps suggest playing a 5-2).

Of course if you agree to play unusual methods then you'd better discuss the follow ups. Here bridge logic should help you though.

[mcphee]

I thinnk this hand was a big mess with methods. To me it seems strange to bid 3H simply because you hold a 5 card suit and a maximum. Should bidding stayman promiss something I guess this idea has some merit.

The problem faced here is no one knows for sure what is going on. How can the responder show natural clubs? So my vote goes to 4C being clubs and a solid promiss to partner I will never try playing this method again.

[MFA]

If responder can have a 5+ club suit when bidding 2♣, then 4♣ is natural and 4♦ is a cuebid for clubs. 4NT would then be RKC for clubs.

[kenrexford]

"Undiscussed" calls are a bad idea.

"GP discussed" works, but then what are the GP rules here?

[jdonn]

Obviously clubs are trumps since responder didn't bid 3♠, the only way to support hearts strongly. 4-way transfers have nothing to do with it since many/most who use them start with stayman holding a four card major anyway.

[Lobowolf]

helene_t, on Aug 29 2008, 05:09 AM, said:

1NT-2♣* stayman
3♥*-4♣** 5-card hearts, undiscussed
4♦*- undiscussed

If you like to open 1NT with a 5-card major (and I do), then I strongly advocate playing 1NT - 3♣ as Puppet Stayman. Sounds like clubs are trump to me, but if I'd agreed to play that 3M was a possible response to Stayman, I'd sure discuss what responder's next bid meant.

[cherdano]

Walddk, on Aug 29 2008, 04:53 AM, said:

In my view it depends on methods. Do you play four-way transfers? If yes, 4♣ now is a cue bid for hearts since responder bid Stayman instead of a transfer to clubs. If not, 4♣ is natural, slammy. We must also ask: what would a jump to 3♣ over 1NT be?

Depending on the agreements I outlined above, 4♦ would then be a cue bid, either for hearts or clubs.

This is not how 4-suit transfers are usually played in the US. After showing a minor with a 2S or 2N transfer, you can't show a 4-card major anymore (1N 2S 3C 3H typically shows heart shortness). So with 4216 and interest in playing spades, responder would stayman and bid 3C over 2D or 2H. This would be a likely shape on the given auction.