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High level doubles, 2 suiters and such like

#1 User is offline   jillybean 

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Posted 2008-August-04, 16:47

>(3♠) negative
(4♥) 4N 5/5 minors
(4♥) 4♠ - you are obviously going to have something in the minors too, is pard
expected to bid a minor with zero tolerance for ♠?
(4♠) 4N 2 suited pard must respond ♣ when ♦>♣>♥
(4♥) X penalty
(4♠) X penalty

What have I missed?
“It is not because things are difficult that we do not dare, it is because we do not dare that they are difficult.”
"You need to play a lot of stuff these days just to deal with the stuff your opponents are playing" DBurn
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#2 User is offline   jdonn 

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Posted 2008-August-04, 17:09

jillybean2, on Aug 4 2008, 05:47 PM, said:

(4♥) 4♠  - you are obviously going to have something in the minors too, is pard
expected to bid a minor with zero tolerance for ♠?

No, why are you going to have something in the minors? You might, but if you have just spades you will bid spades :D

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(4♠) 4N  2 suited  pard must respond ♣ when ♦>♣>♥

Very good.

Quote

(4♥) X penalty

No! Yipe, it's takeout. You can certainly be offshape since there isn't any room to work with, but it's absolutely not showing a heart stack, it invites partner to go to spades if he likes them for example.

Quote

(4♠) X penalty

More controversial perhaps, but still takeout for me. The old fashioned way was to use 4NT as a takeout, but there were two gigantic problems. One was that partner often wants to pass your takeout double at this level (he doesn't want to bid a suit so high without something like a weak two bid). The other was that you couldn't show two-suited hands.

Frankly, you get more penalties by playing double as takeout anyway since it's much more common to be short in a suit they open at this level. Partner usually passes your double when it's so high.
Please let me know about any questions or interest or bug reports about GIB.
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#3 User is offline   jillybean 

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Posted 2008-August-04, 19:34

jdonn, on Aug 4 2008, 04:09 PM, said:

jillybean2, on Aug 4 2008, 05:47 PM, said:

(4♥) X penalty

No! Yipe, it's takeout. You can certainly be offshape since there isn't any room to work with, but it's absolutely not showing a heart stack, it invites partner to go to spades if he likes them for example.

Apparently not by everyone, people do play ‘any double over 3♠ is for penalty’ perhaps not distinguishing between competitive and non competitive auctions?
“It is not because things are difficult that we do not dare, it is because we do not dare that they are difficult.”
"You need to play a lot of stuff these days just to deal with the stuff your opponents are playing" DBurn
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#4 User is offline   han 

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Posted 2008-August-04, 20:23

Agree with Donn, don't know anybody who plays 4H-Dbl as penalty.
Please note: I am interested in boring, bog standard, 2/1.

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#5 User is offline   jillybean 

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Posted 2008-August-04, 23:50

This is a thread I wish would go away, I was having a blonde moment
“It is not because things are difficult that we do not dare, it is because we do not dare that they are difficult.”
"You need to play a lot of stuff these days just to deal with the stuff your opponents are playing" DBurn
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