[1eyedjack]

Hi, I am new to 2/1, and learning it on the fly without much in the way of reference works, so please be patient with this rather elementary question.

Is 1D-2C by a non-passed hand GF?
What is meant by 1D-2N by a non-passed hand?
What do you respond to 1D with 3-3-3-4 and (say)11-12 points?
What do you respond to 1D with 3-1-3-6 and 10 points?
Is 1D-2C-2N forcing?
You are playing 15-17 1N opener and open 1D with 4-4-3-2 and 12 points. Partner responds 2C. What is your rebid? If it is 2NT, what is your rebid with 14 points? (question assumes 2C response is not GF ... ignore if it is GF.)
Does 1D-2C-2H now promise that D suit is genuine, and does it show extras?

No doubt there is scope for agreeing all sorts of different methods here.

Finally, problem hand (North opens 1D, uncontested)

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Do you agree that you want to be in 6D on this hand?
How should the hand be bid?

Thanks

[luis]

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Is 1D-2C by a non-passed hand GF?

Depends on your partneship agreements. I like to play 1d-2c GF a lot. So if you ask me: yes it is.

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What is meant by 1D-2N by a non-passed hand?

Invitational, usually 11-12 HCP or very good 10HCP.

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What do you respond to 1D with 3-3-3-4 and (say)11-12 points?

As I said before 2NT.

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What do you respond to 1D with 3-1-3-6 and 10 points?

2c, 1s, 2NT, 1NT or 3c depending on the hand.
If you play 1d-2c as GF it is a good idea to play 1d-3c as INV with very good clubs and 9/10 HCP. So depending on the club suit, the intermediates and other factors you can bid 2c, 3c, 1N, 2N or even 1s if the other bids are not appealing.

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Is 1D-2C-2N forcing?

As long as 1d-2c is GF yes of course this is forcing.

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You are playing 15-17 1N opener and open 1D with 4-4-3-2 and 12 points. Partner responds 2C. What is your rebid? If it is 2NT, what is your rebid with 14 points? (question assumes 2C response is not GF ... ignore if it is GF.)

If 1d-2c is not GF then 2NT shows 12-14 so 12 or 14 are in the same range.

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Does 1D-2C-2H now promise that D suit is genuine, and does it show extras?

If 1d-2c is game forcing I like to play that 2h shows a balanced hand with 4h and 3/4 diamonds.
If not then it is a reverse by opener so it is strong. Sometimes with 3h as an artificial force.

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Do you agree that you want to be in 6D on this hand?
How should the hand be bid?

I guess you meant that south opens 1d uncontested because north has a clear 1c opening bid.

No. I don't think you want to play 6d

1d - 2c (gf)
2d (shows 5) - 3c
3d - 3h
3s - 3nt
pass

[1eyedjack]

Thanks, Luis

Yes, most of the questions become irrelevant if 2C is GF.

We were playing 1D-3C as weak, and I think I shall have to change that.

Follow-up questions:

Q1:
If 1D-2C is GF. then I feel it right to rebid 2NT with balanced hand and then look for major suit fit. I am not sure why you prefer to rebid 2H with 4H and 3/4D after GF 2C response. I expect this is too complicated to explain, so never mind.

If 1D-2C is not GF then I would be unhappy about rebidding 2NT 12-14. Too wide a range. If you feel then need to have invitational responses to a 3-point range 1NT opener then the same requirements appear to apply here, but you lack room to invite. Perhaps this is a strong argument for 2C being GF. This is not a question, by the way, just an observation.

Q2:
If 1D-2C is GF, how do you distinguish 1D-2C-2N v 1D-2C-3N?

Thanks
(and yes you are right, it was South not North who opened 1D)

[1eyedjack]

Sorry, had a further thought.

One problem that I expect to encounter repeatedly is one or other hand taking the plunge to show extra values when a GF auction has been established.

The above hand may be a bad 6D. But it only requires either hand to have a tiny bit extra for it to be good. And yet if both hands feel that the pressure is "off" to show the extras, in the interests of taking it slowly, then I can see the auction drifting to a halt in game. I don't really expect an answer to this problem because it is simply too vague. If I hit the problem in practice I shall post an example.

[luis]

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Q1:
If 1D-2C is GF. then I feel it right to rebid 2NT with balanced hand and then look for major suit fit. I am not sure why you prefer to rebid 2H with 4H and 3/4D after GF 2C response. I expect this is too complicated to explain, so never mind.

I like the 2d rebid with all hands where opener has 5+ diamonds. So 2h/2s and 2NT show balanced hands without 5 diamonds and 4h/4s/no major. This approach has a lot of advantages in the subsequent bidding so I encourage to try it.

1d-2c

2d: 5+ diamonds, can still have a 4 card major
2h/2s: 4 cards, balanced hands
2n: balanced hand without 4m
3c: 4 card raise

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If 1D-2C is not GF then I would be unhappy about rebidding 2NT 12-14. Too wide a range. If you feel then need to have invitational responses to a 3-point range 1NT opener then the same requirements appear to apply here, but you lack room to invite. Perhaps this is a strong argument for 2C being GF. This is not a question, by the way, just an observation.

I have a very good answer to this question: Open good 14 HCP hands with 1NT and you don't have this problem. Because if you have 14 then it's a bad hand and you don't risk missing a good game.

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Q2:
If 1D-2C is GF, how do you distinguish 1D-2C-2N v 1D-2C-3N?

3NT is a non-existant bid once 1d-2c is game forcing. 2N is unlimited.

[1eyedjack]

Thanks again.

Do you play 1C-2N the same as 1D-2N?

Not obviously relevant to this thread but there is a connection in the back of my mind: Which minor (if either) do you habitually prefer to open with 4-4 in the minors, balanced, 12-14?

[Gerben47]

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Is 1D-2C by a non-passed hand GF?

In different partnerships the answer is yes and no...

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What is meant by 1D-2N by a non-passed hand?

Natural invitation, balanced, about 11-12 points.

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What do you respond to 1D with 3-3-3-4 and (say)11-12 points?

2NT

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What do you respond to 1D with 3-1-3-6 and 10 points?

2C if that's not GF, else 3C. If 2C is not GF you can use 3C as a diamond raise.

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Is 1D-2C-2N forcing?
You are playing 15-17 1N opener and open 1D with 4-4-3-2 and 12 points. Partner responds 2C. What is your rebid? If it is 2NT, what is your rebid with 14 points? (question assumes 2C response is not GF ... ignore if it is GF.)

I'm playing 14 - 16 NT to avoid this and other problems, but I'd say 3NT with hands that would accept an invitation. See the trick below to see what to do with 18-19 balanced hands in this case.

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Does 1D-2C-2H now promise that D suit is genuine, and does it show extras?

If 2C is GF the answer is yes (else just bid 2NT). If not, here's a trick I play (I know this complicates things).
1D - 2C - 2H =
a) GF club raise -> 1D - 2C - 2H - 3C is non-forcing
GF with 5D + 4H
c) Any strength, 4=4=4=1 / 4=4=5=0.
And if you play 15-17 NT, you can add:
d) 18 - 19 balanced

2S inquires and opener rebids:

2NT with a 3-suiter and a minimum
3C with GF club support
3D with a reverse with 0/1 club
3H with a reverse with 2 clubs
3S with a 3-suiter and a singleton club
3NT with 18 - 19 balanced
4C with a club void and 15+

Gerben

[luis]

1eyedjack, on Mar 29 2004, 10:56 PM, said:

Thanks again.

Do you play 1C-2N the same as 1D-2N?

Not obviously relevant to this thread but there is a connection in the back of my mind: Which minor (if either) do you habitually prefer to open with 4-4 in the minors, balanced, 12-14?

Yup 1c-2N is the same as 1d-2N. It's interesting to play that 1c-1N promises 4 clubs and it may be interesting to do the same with 1c-2N.

With 4-4 in the minors and 12-14 I open the better minor when playing strong NT (argh), frequently the hand is not yours so telling your pd what to lead is a good thing.

[1eyedjack]

Quite like that, as it seems to enable an inverted minor raise to be GF, especially after 1C.

A bit more tricky after 1D. May have to give up the weak 3D raise, and play 2D as GF and 3D as invitational with long D (ie as per 1D-3C). Could work. Weak 3D is not going to talk them out of anything. 1N response is perhaps more likely to do so, as opps cannot gauge the size of the fit.

[lifemonster]

I'd like to recommend what we play here. I believe it used be part of "Montreal Standard" and it's highly practical.

Pre-alert:
Our 1C can be doubleton if, and only if, 4-4-3-2.
Thus, our 1D opener always guarantees 4-card suit.

Our 1D-2C is NOT GF.

After 1D-2C, opener rebids

2D=can be 4-card suit, when minimum balanced(ie, 12), or 4441 short in clubs;
2H/2S=reverse, GF
2NT=GF, ie, 14
3C=not GF

After 1D-2C-2D, responder bids
2H/2S=natural and GF, longer C
2NT/3C=NOT GF
3D=GF

[lifemonster]

You can play 1D-2C as GF. In that case,

1D-2C-2NT=12-14,

and you need gadgets to show 4441, short in club hands, and "good/bad raise" to 3C.

I believe the popular way is

1D-2C-2H=4441 exactly

1D-2C-2S=good 3C raise, extra

1D-2C-3C=bad 3C raise

Such sequences are used to be designed for weak NT, but work with any NT range.

[Trpltrbl]

I play 1♦- 2♣ as GF unless I rebid the suit, the it is more like SAYC or ACOL. But that is the only case, all other 2/1 are GF.

Mike