[Cascade]

hrothgar, on Mar 21 2008, 02:19 AM, said:

It probably won't surprise anyone to hear that I would have opened 1NT on the previous round

We regularly open 1NT with this shape too. Singleton spades and clubs often make for difficult rebids after a suit opening.

Of course we play a weak no trump in first and second seat so there are some different considerations.

[Cascade]

foo, on Mar 21 2008, 05:53 AM, said:

inquiry, on Mar 20 2008, 11:45 AM, said:

In the olden days, worried about a rebid, we would have opened south a "prepared" 1♥ and rebid 2♦ and be fairly happy...sigh.... here i rebid an unhappy 1NT or unhappy 2♣

...and playing 4cM and Strong NT, I might still open a 1H and rebid (an unhappy)2D.

It works for the Acol folks...

There aren't that many "Acol folks" in my experience that start with a four-card major and rebid a five-card side suit.

Partner has a habit of putting you into unplayable Moysians after that start.

[awm]

At the table I tried rebidding 2♦. While I don't have any particular qualms about rebidding 1NT with this distribution, the hand seemed a little strong for that action (while a little weak for a reverse). While bidding 2♣ is apparently popular, it seems like a 1NT or 2♦ rebid is more likely to find us a heart fit if we have one. Anyways, the full hand:

Scoring: IMP

---

I got to play in my 2♦ rebid, violating Burn's law. A heart was lead to dummy's ace and I played a diamond to the ten and jack. A heart was continued to my hand, I tried ace and a trump getting the lousy news. LHO cashed the two top spades, me ruffing the second. At this point I cashed the top two clubs ending in dummy, ruffed a spade with my last trump, and cashed the club jack for a very shaky making two.

Rebidding 1NT probably leads to playing there. This may well be the same +90 I got in 2♦, but it has the advantage of being totally cold rather than requiring a guess of the club queen and perhaps sub-optimal defense.

Rebidding 2♣ should fetch a 3♣ raise, which probably lands you in 3NT. This is not the worst game I've ever been in, but is probably not worth it to bid even vulnerable at IMPs. Making it will require the opponents not leading spades and additionally declarer guessing to drop the doubleton queen of clubs. Rebidding 2♥ should also land you in 3NT, as should opening 1NT.

[han]

My first preference is 2C, the only other call I would consider is 2D. I don't think 1NT, 2H and 2S should be considered.

[skjaeran]

han, on Mar 21 2008, 01:20 AM, said:

My first preference is 2C, the only other call I would consider is 2D. I don't think 1NT, 2H and 2S should be considered.

I miscounted the hand initially, so 1NT isn't possible for me either. I prefer 2♦ slightly over 2♣.

[nick_s]

For me this is very close between 2♣ and 2♦. I chose 2♦ because I can't stand a raise to 3♣. Make the hand very slightly stronger - enough to convert 3♣ to 3NT, and I think 2♣ is the better call.

Edit to fix symbols.

[ASkolnick]

OK. I play Wk NT's, but wouldn't that make a 1N rebid easier for me, not harder since I have the 15-17 range.

The only auction which buries me, is 1D-1S-1N-4S, but everything else gets me off.

If my hand was weaker (12-13 HCP), it would be a harder question

I don't play 1D-1M-2C as artificial, however, I do play it as forcing for one round. So, it would not be a terrible lie.

[han]

nick_s, on Mar 21 2008, 08:59 AM, said:

For me this is very close between 2♣ and 2♦. I chose 2♦ because I can't stand a raise to 3♣.

Why can you not stand a 3♣ raise, don't you have an easy 3NT bid?

[nick_s]

han, on Mar 21 2008, 01:48 PM, said:

nick_s, on Mar 21 2008, 08:59 AM, said:

For me this is very close between 2♣ and 2♦.  I chose 2♦ because I can't stand a raise to 3♣.

Why can you not stand a 3♣ raise, don't you have an easy 3NT bid?

I would expect my partner to raise to 3♣ on a good 8 count with 4 clubs.

[pclayton]

2♣. Gives us the most options.

[Cascade]

Jlall, on Mar 21 2008, 12:32 PM, said:

The hand is too strong to rebid 1N, ...

I am happy to underbid a little without a fit for partner.

[jdonn]

Cascade, on Mar 21 2008, 03:33 PM, said:

Jlall, on Mar 21 2008, 12:32 PM, said:

The hand is too strong to rebid 1N, ...

I am happy to underbid a little without a fit for partner.

It's far premature to assume this is a misfit at this point IMO. Also the ten of diamonds negates that aspect even if it exists.

[junyi_zhu]

awm, on Mar 20 2008, 08:23 AM, said:

You open 1♦ in third seat and partner responds 1♠. 2/1, 15-17 NTs.

Scoring: IMP

---

if you face an unpassed partner, it's a clear 2D rebid. 2C is a bid that looks pretty but may lead you landing at wrong slams when partner has some sort of club fit and extra value.

In the real situation, 2C is still a bid that looks pretty but may get you nowhere after
partner's raise to 3C, cause you know this hand is quite misfitted and 3nt doesn't have to be good. 1NT is my second choice, but many nowadays upgrade 14 and open 1NT, so partner may not expect you to rebid 1NT with a pretty good 15 and may pass your 1NT rebid with some pretty good 10 or very bad 11, still even when he has a bad 11 or good 10, 3nt doesn't have to be very good if he has no diamond fit.

That's why 2D is good, it shows your partner the major feature of this hand, also, 2D's range is rather wide, from good 10 to bad 16, so partner can make some educated guess to bid more when he has diamond fit and pass it when he detects misfit. Even if you play 4 card major, this hand is still the best to open 1D IMO.

Another issue is that whether you should open 1NT, I'd open it only when I hold stiff SK
or SA and bad diamonds. like this: A AKxx Jxxxx Kxx. For the real hand, 1NT is a big distortion and may cost you a lot of imps cause you won't be able to show your 5-4 red suits which can be critical for slam or game bidding facing an unpassed partner.
even facing an passed partner, xxx Axx Kxxxx Kx, 6D is cold, 3NT has no play after spade lead and you have no normal gadget to find your D fit if you open 1NT. Although you don't have to find 6D, at least 5D should be bid IMO.

IMO, when you have a choice, you want to avoid rebidding 3 card suit, especially face an unpassed partner, cause he may sometimes take your second suit too seriously, and the damage can rarely be recovered.