[xx1943]

Scoring: IMP

---

West North East South

Pass Pass 1♠ ????

[xx1943]

Scoring: IMP

---

West North East South

 Pass  Pass  1♠    2♥
 Pass  Pass  3♦    3♥
 3♠    Pass  Pass  Pass
 
This is the full hand and the bidding at our table.
We lost 9 IMPs while 8 tables out of 16 played 4♥ sometimes doubled.

From 16 Souths bid 2♥ 9 times, 3♥ 2 times and 4h 5 times.

My questions are:

1) What do you think is the best first bid for South?
2) Should North bid NT after p p 1♠ 2♥ p ???
3) How do you share the blame between North and South for not reaching 4♥?

Al

[gnasher]

1) 4H. I don't know who can make what, so why should the opponents?
4H may make, or they may bid 4S and go off, or it may go one down undoubled and be a save against 3S. The downsides are that it may go for 200 against a partscore, or talk them into bidding 4S when they wouldn't have done otherwise.

2) I think he's fairly close to bidding. but I wouldn't.

3) I don't really do blame - it's bad for morale.

[Rossoneri]

I would bid 4.

No, I would not bid NT.

If I had to choose someone, S.

[Cascade]

xx1943, on Feb 29 2008, 09:07 PM, said:

Scoring: IMP

---

West North East South

 Pass  Pass  1♠    2♥
 Pass  Pass  3♦    3♥
 3♠    Pass  Pass  Pass
 
This is the full hand and the bidding at our table.
We lost 9 IMPs while 8 tables out of 16 played 4♥ sometimes doubled.

From 16 Souths bid 2♥ 9 times, 3♥ 2 times and 4h 5 times.

My questions are:

1) What do you think is the best first bid for South?
2) Should North bid NT after p p 1♠ 2♥ p ???
3) How do you share the blame between North and South for not reaching 4♥?

Al

My partner raises to 4♥ if i bid 3♥ all by myself and she has two aces.

[P_Marlowe]

2H, but 4H may well be better.

The main problem I have with 4H is, that
I dont know, if they can make anything,
I am quite strong, and on the other hand,
I am not sure we can make 4H, so I try
to go low.

With kind regards
Marlowe

[P_Marlowe]

[Fluffy]

Yeah mine too, North 150% for passing 3♥, he gets some more blame for passing 2♥ as well.

[gnasher]

Jlall, on Feb 29 2008, 12:19 PM, said:

For those who think north should raise 3H to 4H and/or think the south hand is a 3H bid, you do not play weak jump overcalls, you play intermediate jump overcalls.

I think their idea was that North should raise to 4H after South overcalls 2H and then competes to 3H.

I don't much like the idea of relying on the opponents to balance in order for us to find our cold game. After all, they might decide not to.

Also, if North is going to bid 4H on this, how are we supposed to get to 3H when South has a slightly weaker hand?

[Edmunte1]

I would have bid 4♥, but 2♥ can be a choice, over 3♥ North has a mandatory raise.

[helene_t]

Jlall, on Feb 29 2008, 12:19 PM, said:

For those who think north should raise 3H to 4H and/or think the south hand is a 3H bid, you do not play weak jump overcalls, you play intermediate jump overcalls.

I don't think anyone is arguing that N should raise a weak jump overcall. The issue is raising a 3♥ rebid after a 2♥ overcall.

[Wackojack]

Make it easiest on your partner and hardest on the opps. Bid 4hearts.

[Apollo81]

helene_t, on Feb 29 2008, 09:20 AM, said:

Jlall, on Feb 29 2008, 12:19 PM, said:

For those who think north should raise 3H to 4H and/or think the south hand is a 3H bid, you do not play weak jump overcalls, you play intermediate jump overcalls.

I don't think anyone is arguing that N should raise a weak jump overcall. The issue is raising a 3♥ rebid after a 2♥ overcall.

right

[inquiry]

xx1943, on Feb 29 2008, 03:07 AM, said:

My questions are:
1) What do you think is the best first bid for South?

I think it is a fine bid. In fact, I would bid 2♥ when I didn't have an intermediate jump overcalls when vulnerable available. Assuming 3♥ is intermediate showing this kind of hand, then I would have overcalled 3♥. 4♥ is too rich for me, but double and then bid ♥ is also ok too, but this hand is not quite strong enough for that.

Quote

2) Should North bid NT after p p 1♠ 2♥ p ???

No. Sometimes you can't bid every game. Give your self the ATxx of spades,

Quote

3) How do you share the blame between North and South for not reaching 4♥?

East gave you a chance to reach 4♥ when he reopened with 3♦. Without the reopen, if anyone has to accept the blame, it is South. Once South bid 3♥, however, North takes the blame, as with two aces, he has a clear 4♥ bid now.

[Cascade]

I tend to bid 2♥ on hands like this but there is obvious merit in 4♥.

The problem with 2♥ is that when partner has no fit (or is unaware of the fit e.g. when having two cards opposite a six-card suit that could be only five or a good singleton opposite a seven-card suit that could be only five or six) but has some values that could be enough for game there is no clear bid. This means that partner may pass when there is game on.

I have been wondering recently whether the cue (2♠ that we all play as a cue-raise) would be better used as some sort of nebulous force only possibly with support.

[han]

Wayne, do you bid an intermediate 3♥ with this hand if available?

[Halo]

Just voted 4H.

I don't believe accuracy is the issue. If four is over the top and I lose a part score swing, I'd do it again.

[whereagles]

I'd bid 3 or 4, depending on how lucky I feel.

[Cascade]

han, on Mar 1 2008, 10:31 AM, said:

Wayne, do you bid an intermediate 3♥ with this hand if available?

Vulnerable this would be a maximum intermediate 2♥ for me over 1minor.

I don't like intermediate jumps to the three-level unless they are well defined since over a three-level bid there is not room to invite.

I usually play intermediate jumps to the two-level but not to the three-level.

If available something like 3♥ 13-15 would be ok with this hand.