[Gerben42]

Scoring: IMP

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North deals and opens 2♦ Multi, South bids 2♥ (pass or correct), North bids 2♠.

[Fluffy]

(2♦)-ps-(2♥)-X
(2♠)-3♣!-(ps)-??

3♣! = possitive

Ugh, this is tough, how are you suposed to find a 4-4 fit when you made a take out double of that suit? .

West 'could' bid 3♥ over 3♣ but the meaning will be very obscure. He has no club fit, and I wonder if 4NT is quantitative or blackwood now. Probably blackwood.

So the best I can find:

(2♦)-ps-(2♥)-X
(2♠)-3♣!-(ps)-6NT

[655321]

Fluffy, on Jan 14 2008, 05:18 AM, said:

So the best I can find:

(2♦)-ps-(2♥)-X
(2♠)-3♣!-(ps)-6NT

What Fluffy said.

West's X is takeout of ♥, so a double of 2♠ by East would be penalty.

[whereagles]

I would probably bid it like this:

2♦ pass 2♥ 3NT (end)

[Gerben42]

Anyway here was our sequence:

2♦ Pass 2♥ Dbl
2♠ Pass Pass Dbl
Pass 3♠ Pass 4NT
Pass 5NT Pass 6NT

I didn't want to "guess" a minor after 2♠ opposite a TO of ♥. It appears that opps have a 6-2 ♠ fit, but no way I'd find out what minor we would like to play. And guessing wrong would result in 2 down vuln. no doubt, so I passed.

[miguelm]

If you started with a Double you can't double again as that would be for penalties IMHO.... nor can you cue 3S (at least I don't think you can without a club fit of some sort...).
Anyway, what is so wrong about passing the first round of the auction...?

2D.....P......2H......P
2S.....P......P.......?

Now, all you have to do is to bid the way to show you strenght, which for me is a direct 3NT. That followed by 4C (Baron) will surely put you on your way to slam where you belong

[655321]

miguelm, on Jan 14 2008, 06:48 AM, said:

Anyway, what is so wrong about passing the first round of the auction...?

2♦.....P......2♥......P
P.....P

Too late - they have stopped in their 6-2 heart fit and you have just missed 6♠.
Bad luck!

[P_Marlowe]

Hi,

(2D) - Pass.. - (2H) - X (1)
(2S) - 3C (2) - (Pass) - 3S (3)
(Pass) - 4D (4) - (Pass) - 4NT(5)
(Pass) - 5D (5) - (Pass) - 5S (6)
(Pass) - 6C (6) - (Pass) - 6NT(7)


(1) t/o for hearts
(2) positive, 2 NT would be Lebensohl for us
X would be nice, but it should show a 4 card
suit, in other words it would be penalty
Maybe responder can see, that West
is sitting on a strong bal. hand, and make
a enterprising X, but a strong 1-dimensional
hand is still possible
(3) torture bid, i.e. asking for a spade stopper
and further description
(4) 2nd suit
(5) RKCB, 1 KC
(6) asking for cheapest king, showing king of
clubs, denying king of spades
(7) no idea, what else to do, having diamonds agreed,
makes if hard to go beyond 6D, we may end up
in 7D

With kind regards
Marlowe

[miguelm]

655321, on Jan 14 2008, 06:58 AM, said:

miguelm, on Jan 14 2008, 06:48 AM, said:

Anyway, what is so wrong about passing the first round of the auction...?

2♦.....P......2♥......P
P.....P

Too late - they have stopped in their 6-2 heart fit and you have just missed 6♠.
Bad luck!

Right lol, I totally missed that....

So, 3NT in first round it is

[hrothgar]

655321, on Jan 14 2008, 02:58 PM, said:

miguelm, on Jan 14 2008, 06:48 AM, said:

Anyway, what is so wrong about passing the first round of the auction...?

2♦.....P......2♥......P
P.....P

Too late - they have stopped in their 6-2 heart fit and you have just missed 6♠.
Bad luck!

Worse yet, given the vulnerability there is a very real chance that they might also have passed out on the 3-2 Spade fit...

Lots of folks will pass out a 2♥ pass or correct response holding Spades if they are Non Vulnerable

[Codo]

I think the first X was mandatory 3 NT shows not a big balanced hand but a running minor and stoppers, doesn´t it?
I would like to have an agreement that pd can double their 2 spade responsive. But unluckily I do not have this agreement.

But having passed 2 Diamond, East can bid 2 NT now, showing the minors. This will lead to 6 Diamond, maybe not the best contract, but better then most others.

If this tool is not avaiable and 2 NT is lebensolish, I would have passed with the East hand, having no bid avaiable. After a second double, I had still no clue how to find 6 in a red suit and maybe I had bid 3 Clubs like Fluffy, reaching a quite inferior spot

[Fluffy]

Gerben42, on Jan 14 2008, 11:45 AM, said:

I didn't want to "guess" a minor after 2♠ opposite a TO of ♥. It appears that opps have a 6-2 ♠ fit, but no way I'd find out what minor we would like to play. And guessing wrong would result in 2 down vuln. no doubt, so I passed.

This makes a lot of sense.

[Cascade]

(2♦) Pass (2♥) Dbl*
(2♠) Dbl** (Pass) 3♠
(Pass) 4♥ (Pass) 4NT
(Pass) 5♣ (Pass) 5♦
(Pass) 5♥ (Pass) 6♥
All Pass


* typically a useful weak NT but can be various stronger hands
** Takeout

[Cascade]

Codo, on Jan 15 2008, 03:54 AM, said:

I think the first X was mandatory 3 NT shows not a big balanced hand but a running minor and stoppers, doesn´t it?

No.

It just shows a hand with limited interest in the majors. I would routinely bid 3NT here with a hand too good for 2NT and say 2=2=5=4 or 2=2=4=5 as well as hands more single-suited in a minor.

[JanM]

Interesting pair of hands. My multi defense expert suggests:

2♦ - P - 2♥ - DBL    DBL = either a TO of hearts or any strong hand
2♠ -3♣ - P - 3♠    3♣ is in the context of Lebensohl so shows some values. 3♠ hadn't previously been discussed but obviously shows a good hand and since we didn't bid 3NT, it should show a TO of spades, thus have hearts (unless it's a cue bid for clubs).
4♥ - P - 6♥    4♥ because 3♠ promised hearts and might not have diamonds (obviously it might have had clubs, but if that's the case, the dbler will now show club support). 6♥ because it's unlikely that partner will have enough for 7 and have bid this way (3♠ over 2♠ would have shown short spades with enough to force to game, about 10+ HCP, so partner can't have that much, at least not with the spade stiff we think he has from the opponents' bidding and need for 7 anyway). Of course partner might have enough (x, QTxx, Kxx, Kxxxx probably makes 7 good), but there's really no way to find out. And it's hard to imagine a hand that partner thinks merits 3♣ and has 4 hearts that won't make 6.

[Free]

I would start like Fluffy as well

[Gerben42]

The hand had a happy end when the Multi opener decided not to lead away from his ♠KJ and led a ♣ instead. <phew>

The other room played game so we won 11 here.