[Yogeshdg]

I dont play standard but i am curious as to wat rebid of 2minor shows. Is it 11-14 or 11-16? The reason i ask is i have seen many players rebid 2 minor with 15 or 16hcp and their pd with 8-9 hcp passes and they miss a cold 3nt! Some seem to jump to 3minor with 15-16 which is NF but at least pd with 8+knows to bid 3nt .What does standard say?

[kfay]

My partner and I play a system here and I have been wondering what people might think of it.

It should be noted that a 1-level jump in the suit above opener's is weak (1♦-2♥ or 1♣-2♦). Edit: 1♥-2♠ too, obviously, but this thread is about 1m-1M-2m

The rest of it goes like this:

After an opening bid, a one-level response, and opener's minimum rebid of or below his first suit, the following rules apply:

1) All of responder's 3-level rebids are natural and game-forcing.

2) Responder's rebid of 2NT is natural and invitational.

3) Responder's rebid of two of his first-bid suit is natural (usually 6) and invitational, except that 1♥-1♠; 2♦/♥-2♠ doesn't promise more than a 4-card suit (and is therefore a one-round force).

4) Responder's two-level rebid of 3rd or 4th suit, if above his first-bid suit is a (potentially) artificial game invitation. After an auction such as 1♦-1♥; 2♣/♦-2♠, opener usually relays with 2NT but with extra shape and values can further pattern out instead.

5) Responder's two-level rebid of 3rd or 4th suit, if below his first-bid suit, is a relay to the next higher suit, and is either a drop in a major or an invitation in responder's next-bid suit. For example, after 1♦-1♠; 2♣/♦-2♥, opener almost always bids 2♠ which responder may pass to play or bid 3♣/♦/♠ to invite there. (Responder's 2NT in such a sequence, should probably be a one-round force as he could have bid a nonforcing 2NT directly.) NOTE: we only have 3 sequences where this would come up -- 1♦-1♠; 2♣-2♥, 1♦-1♠; 2♦-2♥, 1♥-1♠; 2♣-2♦.

6) Responder's two-level rebid of opener's first-bid suit is usually to play (e.g., 1♦-1♥; 2♣-2♦), however in the specific auction 1♥-1♠; 2♣, responder's 2♥ is invitational since he could bid 2♦ if he wishes drop in either hearts or spades.

[helene_t]

whereagles, on Nov 8 2007, 05:51 PM, said:

gonzalo, that style (1m-1x-2m = 6 cards) is normal across the ocean

Does "across" mean East or West? I thought opening 1♦ with 45 minors to avoid bidding clubs twice is mainly an American thing, although many over here do it also. As for offshape notrump rebids my impression is that they are somewhat more normal here.

Personally I prefer a style in which we almost never rebid a five-card minor. Would do it with 0445 and lousy diamonds, though. (Except that I don't play natural a 1♣ opening that often these days).

[karlson]

helene_t, on Nov 9 2007, 10:25 AM, said:

whereagles, on Nov 8 2007, 05:51 PM, said:

gonzalo, that style (1m-1x-2m = 6 cards) is normal across the ocean

Does "across" mean East or West? I thought opening 1♦ with 45 minors to avoid bidding clubs twice is mainly an American thing, although many over here do it also. As for offshape notrump rebids my impression is that they are somewhat more normal here.

Personally I prefer a style in which we almost never rebid a five-card minor. Would do it with 0445 and lousy diamonds, though. (Except that I don't play natural a 1♣ opening that often these days).

I think the opening 1d with 4-5 in the minors is more of an old-school american style, which is losing popularity. Although, I do know many good (some young) players that do play this way.

The off-shape 1N rebids seem to be a pretty mainstream modern trend to me. I learned this style a few years ago, and every time I've asked any new junior-ish partner whether we play this way, I got the "yeah, duh" look. Of course maybe it's area-specific too (I'm in San Francisco).

[Fluffy]

Yogeshdg, on Nov 9 2007, 01:12 AM, said:

I dont play standard but i am curious as to wat rebid of 2minor shows. Is it 11-14 or 11-16? The reason i ask is i have seen many players rebid 2 minor with 15 or 16hcp and their pd with 8-9 hcp passes and they miss a cold 3nt! Some seem to jump to 3minor with 15-16 which is NF but at least pd with 8+knows to bid 3nt .What does standard say?

standard.... you could say that standard jump rebid is 15-17, but when the player gets some extra experience, suit quality of the gonna be main source of tricks plays a much more important role than scarced Qs and Js, so 14 HCP with a good suit can rebid 3, while 17 with a bad suit might rebid just 2.

[foo]

karlson, on Nov 7 2007, 01:32 AM, said:

Does anyone have good agreements in 1m-1M-2m auctions? Care to share?

One of the big problems I have with standardish treatments is that there seems to be no forcing way to agree M after the relay. For instance, 1d-1s-2d-2h-2s, and there's no way to set spades in a forcing way. But I've never felt comfortable in these auctions in general.

Oh, we play the (now standard?) style where 2m shows 6, and we sometimes raise 1M on 6-3.

What style you play influences what you use your sequences for.

1m-2M;2m shows 6+m or a 5 carder that is expected to take more tricks than the average 6 (something like Hhhxx or better) and no better rebid. I tend strongly that 1m-1M;2M promises 4+ card support.

So
1m-1S;2m-2H is a minimum =54 or =55 in S+H
But what about Invitational and GF hands with =54, =45, and =55 in S+H?

1m-1M;2m-2M shows a minimum with 6+M
1m-1M;2m-3M is usually played as an Invitational hand with 6+M.
1m-1M;2m-4M takes up too much room to be used for all GF hands. It has to to be To Play.
What should one do with a Responding hand that might be interested in slam and 6+M? or an Invitational or better =46 or =64 in S+H?

What about Slam interested responding hands with 4+M and support for Opener's minor?

We obviously need another way to bid Invitational or some complicated hands.

1C-1M;2C-2D! and 1D-1M;2D-3C! are those ways.
Both are intuitive extensions to NMF (1D-1M;2D-3C! obviously requires GF values)

You give up the ability to bid the unbid minor naturally. IME, the convention is well worth the price.