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Is this forcing?

Poll: How obvious is it that 4c is (non)forcing? (23 member(s) have cast votes)

How obvious is it that 4c is (non)forcing?

  1. Clearly F, everybody plays that (18 votes [78.26%])

    Percentage of vote: 78.26%

  2. F is standard but some deviate (1 votes [4.35%])

    Percentage of vote: 4.35%

  3. There is no standard but most play it as F (2 votes [8.70%])

    Percentage of vote: 8.70%

  4. 50/50 (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

  5. There is no standard but most play it as NF (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

  6. NF is standard but some deviate (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

  7. Clearly F, everybody plays that (1 votes [4.35%])

    Percentage of vote: 4.35%

  8. Other (1 votes [4.35%])

    Percentage of vote: 4.35%

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#1 User is offline   helene_t 

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Posted 2007-October-05, 09:17

1♦-(x)-xx-(p)
2♣-(p)-4♣*

The last option (before "other") should be "clearly NF, everybody plays that".
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#2 User is offline   matmat 

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Posted 2007-October-05, 09:23

i think it's forcing
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#3 User is offline   jtfanclub 

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Posted 2007-October-05, 09:28

helene_t, on Oct 5 2007, 10:17 AM, said:

1♦-(x)-xx-(p)
2♣-(p)-4♣*

The last option (before "other") should be "clearly NF, everybody plays that".

I clicked on the wrong "clearly forcing", but I do think it's clearly forcing.

Man, I have to think about this one. IMHO, the way we play it xx here (10+, does not necessarily deny diamonds), 3♣ instead of 4♣ should be a 1 round force missing a major suit stop (with less than a 12 count, just pass your partner's 2♣ bid, which you forced him to make).

That would make a 4♣...a Splinter in support of diamonds? That doesn't make any sense, does it?

I'll have to keep thinking about it.
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#4 User is offline   drinbrasil 

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Posted 2007-October-05, 09:28

Since xx = 10+, looks that 3♣ would be 11-12 and 4♣ 13+, forcing game.
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#5 User is offline   Free 

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Posted 2007-October-05, 09:39

I think it shows a hand with slam interest, but rather distributional. Since it shows slam interest it's probably forcing although I passed :P I couldn't see me making 5♣ with an honest Dbl behind me.
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#6 User is offline   cherdano 

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Posted 2007-October-05, 09:50

I doubt anyone has discussed this and undiscussed jumps to 4m by an unlimited hand are forcing.

The interesting question is whether 2♣ is forcing.
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#7 User is offline   gwnn 

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Posted 2007-October-05, 10:16

It could never ever be passed. My proposition for interesting part: does opener need to cuebid with any strength or can he s/o in 5♣ with a subminimum?
... and I can prove it with my usual, flawless logic.
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#8 Guest_Jlall_*

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Posted 2007-October-05, 10:47

XX then jump=always forcing.
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#9 User is offline   ArtK78 

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Posted 2007-October-05, 10:51

Clearly forcing. Probably conventional (minorwood is the most obvious possibility).
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#10 User is offline   skjaeran 

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Posted 2007-October-05, 12:03

There's no way it could be non-forcing.
Kind regards,
Harald
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#11 User is offline   joker_gib 

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Posted 2007-October-05, 12:31

If I pass this, I think this is the last time I play with my partner... :)
Alain
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#12 User is offline   Fluffy 

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Posted 2007-October-05, 13:09

almost unanimous :)
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#13 User is offline   P_Marlowe 

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Posted 2007-October-05, 13:15

Hi,

forcing, but you will encounter some, who will
say non-forcing.


With kind regards
Marlowe
With kind regards
Uwe Gebhardt (P_Marlowe)
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#14 User is offline   gwnn 

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Posted 2007-October-05, 14:06

btw how can gerber be passed?
... and I can prove it with my usual, flawless logic.
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#15 User is offline   kenrexford 

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Posted 2007-October-05, 14:21

Jlall, on Oct 5 2007, 11:47 AM, said:

XX then jump=always forcing.

XX then jump below game=always forcing.
"Gibberish in, gibberish out. A trial judge, three sets of lawyers, and now three appellate judges cannot agree on what this law means. And we ask police officers, prosecutors, defense lawyers, and citizens to enforce or abide by it? The legislature continues to write unreadable statutes. Gibberish should not be enforced as law."

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#16 User is offline   Cascade 

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Posted 2007-October-05, 16:04

gwnn, on Oct 6 2007, 08:06 AM, said:

btw how can gerber be passed?

With no aces
Wayne Burrows

I believe that the USA currently hold only the World Championship For People Who Still Bid Like Your Auntie Gladys - dburn
dunno how to play 4 card majors - JLOGIC
True but I know Standard American and what better reason could I have for playing Precision? - Hideous Hog
Bidding is an estimation of probabilities SJ Simon

#17 User is offline   Cascade 

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Posted 2007-October-05, 16:04

I don't know what is standard but to me it makes no sense if this is not forcing.
Wayne Burrows

I believe that the USA currently hold only the World Championship For People Who Still Bid Like Your Auntie Gladys - dburn
dunno how to play 4 card majors - JLOGIC
True but I know Standard American and what better reason could I have for playing Precision? - Hideous Hog
Bidding is an estimation of probabilities SJ Simon
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