[kenrexford]

On the website for the Warren Buffett Cup, it describes the bout as between Europe's top twelve and the top twelve from the USA. "It is Europe's top twelve players against the USA's top twelve." www.buffettcup.com

I'd imagine there are a few who might contest these lists. Sure, all are good, but I think some reasonable candidates have been left off. Curious if there are any similar thoughts out here.

(This is not to mention the other glaring unfortunate reality of this thing -- the slight to many other countries...)

[bid_em_up]

See this thread.

http://forums.bridgebase.com/index.php?sho...14780&hl=buffet

It also appears (if I am reading the website correctly) that all players for the US must use the same convention card (a version of 2/1), and the Europeans have their own CC as well that all European players must use.

This, in and of itself, may have prevented certain top players from accepting an invitation to this event as well (but is only a guess).

In a side note.....From the website:

In a three-part series of interviews presented by Charlie Rose on PBS television from July 10th - 12th 2006 (www.charlierose.com), Buffett added that he would happily pay $5m a year for the right to play 12 hours a day of bridge online with his friends.

I'm sure for 5 million a year....it could be arranged!! lol

Ka-Ching!!

[hrothgar]

Please recall that the selection committee was considering a wide number of different factors beyond bridge skill. Looking at the list, it seems clear that the committee was aiming at georgraphical diversity. In addition, I believe that Fred mentioned that they were also looking for "soft" social skills which might help promoting the tournament.

Personally, I think that the selection committee did a nice job... I'm sure that we can all point at individual players or pairs that we think should have been included, however, the list is made up of very strong players.

Equally significant, when we see certain names missing from the list we really don't have any way of understanding why they aren't playing. Case in point: I think that Meckwell's absence has a lot more to do with system regulations or a prior commitment rather than their skill level. In a similar fashion, I suspect that the Zia - Welland partnership is, to some extent, motivated by the fact that neither Fallenius nor Rosenberg seem like reasonable choices for a North American team.

[paulg]

hrothgar, on Sep 13 2006, 09:26 PM, said:

In a similar fashion, I suspect that the Zia - Welland partnership is, to some extent, motivated by the fact that neither Fallenius nor Rosenberg seem like reasonable choices for a North American team.

It's hard to believe that this would apply to Rosenberg who is an American citizen and has been playing bridge in the USA since he first moved there. He is also more qualified for the North American team than Zia (who is really a global citizen).

I assume that Michael had prior commitments because he and Zia are two players that this tournament needs.

Paul

[kenrexford]

I understand the limitations of invitee status. I also understand the advisibility of having participants have "social graces."

That being said, the promo describes the contestants as the "top twelve players." This is much different from "twelve of the top players." That just seems a tad dishonest and a bit offensive.

[fred]

kenrexford, on Sep 14 2006, 03:28 AM, said:

I understand the limitations of invitee status. I also understand the advisibility of having participants have "social graces."

That being said, the promo describes the contestants as the "top twelve players." This is much different from "twelve of the top players." That just seems a tad dishonest and a bit offensive.

I think that the statement you refer to is no more than marketing. I am sure that the tournament organizers and all the players know this is not accurate. Furthermore, I am sure that the non-participants who play as well as the participants would not feel offended by such a statement - they know it is not meant to be taken seriously. In fact, I suspect that most of these people would agree that the very notion of trying to define "the best x players in country y" is absurd.

The statement in question is similar to the common practice of hyping a boxing (or whatever) match as "The Battle of the Century" (or whatever).

Sorry if you are still offended, but I for one am more excited about playing in this bridge tournament than I have been about any event in recent years. Hope you are able to get over it, sit back, and enjoy what rates to be a great vugraph show.

Fred Gitelman
Bridge Base Inc.
www.bridgebase.com

[whereagles]

It's like the Ryder Cup in golf. I'm looking forward to it

[kenrexford]

Oh, I am looking forward to it. Like I said, this will be a bout between 12 of the top players from each side. I also get the hype, I suppose.

The funny thing is that football season (college, U.S. football) probably is what set me off. The BCS poll decides who is what rank. I dislike that form of competition, where a committee decides who is worthy, no results. The WBBC perhaps only smells bad to me because of its timing with the BCS.

Being an Ohio State fan, though, the BCS is getting a slide this year so far... LOL

[joker_gib]

Great idea and all great players so we should have a great show !

Nothing else to be said about this

[cherdano]

joker_gib, on Sep 14 2006, 03:29 PM, said:

Great idea and all great players so we should have a great show !

Nothing else to be said about this

Yes there is: GO EUROPE GO!

[Walddk]

Let me add that it's now a fact that we will be broadcasting from 6 tables throughout. As a new feature, each banner will be marked with language. The order will be as follows:

1. English.
2. French.
3. English.
4. Polish.
5. English.
6. Chinese.

We were hoping to do Spanish too, but it can't be arranged. The system of scoring they are using is very unusual and quite complex. I suspect there will be a lot of confusion about this among our audience (and the commentators).

In the meantime, you can read about it by visiting the official web site:

http://www.buffettcu...t.aspx?tabid=70

Roland

[cherdano]

Will there be running scores available?

[Walddk]

cherdano, on Sep 14 2006, 08:47 PM, said:

Will there be running scores available?

No info, but I won't rule it out. This event is run by Willem Mevius and Norbert van Woerkom, and they are quite capable. No promises though.

My personal guess is updates once a day. I honestly don't think that they can live up to the service they rendered from Poland. I sincerely hope I'm proven wrong.

Roland

[whereagles]

Damn.. if I had time I'd do the portuguese one..

[Erkson]

Walddk, on Sep 14 2006, 06:37 PM, said:

Let me add that it's now a fact that we will be broadcasting from 6 tables throughout. As a new feature, each banner will be marked with language. The order will be as follows:

1. English.
2. French.
3. English.
4. Polish.
5. English.
6. Chinese.

We were hoping to do Spanish too, but it can't be arranged.

Hi.

I would like to say once more that I am very opposed to multi-language in vugraphs. I would like all comments in English. I am not a native English speaker and my English is poor, but I always could understand the comments.

My main reason is that it happened many times that I wanted to watch a table (closed room, for instance) and the comments were in a language that I didn't understand, so I had to choose another table (open room) which did'nt interest me as much.

I am not particularly glad that basic English has become a lingua franca, but so it is.

Is it possible to be Italian, Polish, Chinese, Arabic, Spanish, French etc... etc...,
invert time in watching bridge vugraph, and being unable to understand basic English ?
IMHO such a person had better to invert time in learning it.

To the humorist who will reply that I should myself learn Italian, Polish, Chinese, Arabic etc... instead of loosing valuable time watching bridge, I will reply that I should be glad to do so, but learning a lingua franca looks to me a better investment of my time.

Erkson

[Gerben42]

Well Poland, China and France are major players in Bridge and since English knowledge in these countries is not as widespread in these countries I can understand how this is sensible.

Finding "the 12 best players" for each side is impossible, but given the results of all 24 players involved this is going to be exciting!

[DenisO]

cherdano, on Sep 14 2006, 07:47 PM, said:

Will there be running scores available?

I find the running scores to be rather minimalist and not very informative. It would be nice to see the scores for each round on a match by match basis. I'd hate to see such poor quality results for the real Ryder Cup

[PeterGill]

A few comments from one of BBO's Vugraph commentators:

1. Perhaps one day in the future, BBO will introduce a feature where the tables being vugraphed in Chinese or Polish have a second copy available in English?

2. The 12 pairs look to me to be very close to the strongest 12 pairs in the world who were available, with the exception of one pair from China who was ineligible, and including one female pair in each team.

It seems to me (from afar) that Meckwell must have been unavailable, and that Lauria - Versace and Fantoni - Nunes were perhaps excluded for geographical reasons. Poland's form over the last two years has not been stunning. Given that Zia simply had to be there with one of his partners, every pair in each team has impeccable credentials, especially on recent form. Given the wide range of views of bridge player ability, I think the teams are fantastic.

Tom Hanlon - Hugh McGann, whose place in the Europe team was questioned on BBO in early July on this forum, played every vital match in leading Ireland to 2nd place in the subsequent European Championships - no surprise to those who have watched them on BBO win the last two Camrose's and the last two Lederer's. Anyone who has watched them play on BBO Vugraph this year would be appallled at the thought that they are merely a home-town token pair. Their selection in the team was clearcut IMO.

Admittedly, I did back Ireland (each-way) in the European Championships on the relevant website, but that was because I had watched them play a lot on BBO Vugraph and knew their form.

3. The score after the Pairs is effectively 16-16.

Peter Gill
Sydney Australia.

[PeterGill]

In reply to Denis O:

I agree. The website's scores are minimalist, possibly due to an apparent attempt to make the scoring similar to golf's Ryder Cup

After three of the five 11-board rounds in the Pairs, I began to reconstruct the scores myself. Let's explain. Hamman - Soloway played against Hanlon - McGann (for scoring purposes, i.e. both pairs sat EW) for ALL FIVE matches, with 2-0 at stake for each of their five clashes. After three rounds, these two pairs were even. The Irish pair won their Round 4 clash (7 boards to 4 IIRC) to score 2-0 for Europe. Hamsol bounced back to win their Round 5 clash (6-5 IIRC) to score 2-0 for USA. Summarising:

Rounds 1-2-3 Rd 4 Rd 5 Rounds 1-5 total
(combined total)

Hamsol v Hanlon - McGann 0 -2 2 0
Zia - Welland v Helness - Helgemo -2 -2 0 -4
Weinstein - B Levin v Hackett twins 2 2 0 4
Hampson - Fred G v Verh - Jansma -2 -2 2 -2
Meyers - J Levin v Bocchi - Duboin -2 2 2 2
Berko - Cohen v Auken - Von Arnim 0 -2 2 0

America relative to Europe -4 -4 8 0

Europe led 12-8 (or something with a difference of 4) after three rounds, 20-12 after 4 rounds, and it is 20 all after five rounds of Pairs, going into the Teams.

Had Steve Weinstein doubled 2NT (which went down one) on the last board
(Bd 55), America would be leading 24-20.

So Bobby Levin (plus 4) and his wife Jill (plus 2, winning both Rounds 4 and 5)
with their partners have been America's strongest performers so far.

I cannot find any data to break down Rounds 1-2-3 into the individual rounds.

In the Teams, each 14 board match will be scored up as 3-0 or 0-3, I think.
The aim is to reproduce matchplay conditions as in the Ryder Cup.

My personal opinion for enxt year's Buffett Cup is that this method could be improved.

Hoping this helps a little bit,
Peter Gill
a BBO Vugraph Commentator
Sydney Australia

[cherdano]

I only watched a few sessions, but I thought it was a great event.

I think hannie predicted here that the Americans might do better in the individual, as there is a lot more common ground in expert understandings in the US than in Europe. I would be curious whether those that have watched the bigger part of the Individual would agree with this, or whether the Americans just judged, played and defended better.

Arend