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Another competing over strong Club

Poll: What do you bid PLAYING NATURAL? (36 member(s) have cast votes)

What do you bid PLAYING NATURAL?

  1. Dbl (1 votes [2.78%])

    Percentage of vote: 2.78%

  2. Pass (8 votes [22.22%])

    Percentage of vote: 22.22%

  3. 1H (9 votes [25.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 25.00%

  4. 2H (1 votes [2.78%])

    Percentage of vote: 2.78%

  5. 3H (6 votes [16.67%])

    Percentage of vote: 16.67%

  6. 4H (11 votes [30.56%])

    Percentage of vote: 30.56%

  7. A psych (which one?) (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

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#1 User is offline   Free 

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Posted 2006-September-08, 16:39

In a MP event, V vs NV, you hold:

Scoring: MP


RHO starts the bidding with 1♣, showing 17+HCP with any distribution. What's your bid playing natural overcalls?
"It may be rude to leave to go to the bathroom, but it's downright stupid to sit there and piss yourself" - blackshoe
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#2 User is offline   hrothgar 

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Posted 2006-September-08, 16:58

Rough one...

Torn between Pass, 3♥, and 4♥ with a slight preference for 4♥
Alderaan delenda est
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#3 User is offline   HeartA 

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Posted 2006-September-08, 17:06

4♥, wtp?
Senshu
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#4 User is offline   whereagles 

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Posted 2006-September-08, 20:38

This is an easy one for me: 4♥, followed by double if they bid over it.
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#5 User is offline   Gerben42 

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Posted 2006-September-09, 03:21

Just two Hearts for me. Then follow that up by 3♥, doubled by opps and maybe it makes :)
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#6 User is online   P_Marlowe 

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Posted 2006-September-11, 05:21

1H, followed by 2H, 3H.

With kind regards
Marlowe
With kind regards
Uwe Gebhardt (P_Marlowe)
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#7 User is offline   whereagles 

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Posted 2006-September-11, 05:50

lol... you guys like to walk the dog? :angry:
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#8 User is offline   mikestar 

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Posted 2006-September-11, 10:01

4♥. If partner has half the outstanding HCP, game is likely and partner won't bid it over 2/3♥.
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#9 User is offline   pclayton 

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Posted 2006-September-11, 11:11

Pass - which shows values (when I make a call later). Surely I'll be able to bid at the 2 level at R2?
"Phil" on BBO
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#10 User is online   mike777 

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Posted 2006-September-11, 11:27

4H now!

We are at unfav. vul and pard should play me for around an 8 trick hand.
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#11 User is offline   dake50 

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Posted 2006-September-11, 20:45

What game are we fearing? 4s sAQ,HAK; 5m? None. What are we making? 17hcp(opener)+16(here)=33; partner has at MOST 7, which 7 makes 4H?
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#12 User is offline   flytoox 

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Posted 2006-September-11, 22:15

MP you should not push them to five level. SO start with 1H. If you bid 4H now, they are going to find a five level contract. Even you double them, it may not worth much MPs.
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#13 User is offline   HeartA 

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Posted 2006-September-11, 23:15

dake50, on Sep 11 2006, 09:45 PM, said:

What game are we fearing? 4s sAQ,HAK; 5m? None. What are we making? 17hcp(opener)+16(here)=33; partner has at MOST 7, which 7 makes 4H?

Real bridge players count tricks, not hcp. I don't need pd to have 7 hcp to make 10 tricks. SK, HQ, or or even Sxx (with S lead) can get us 10 tricks.

You can count (at most) oneH trick for defense. Besides, your LHO could have SK (though not likely).
Senshu
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#14 User is offline   the hog 

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Posted 2006-September-12, 01:53

4H, and I expect to have a good play.
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#15 User is offline   Free 

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Posted 2006-September-12, 02:24

Partner had ♠K and ♥Qxx. If you bid 3♥ he'll pass, but 1♥ will be raised. 2♥ is hard to tell. 4♥ is obviously laydown :D

Imo 1♥ is the best bid: you can show the nice hand you have and don't have to take any risk going down doubled in a partscore deal. 200 at MP is a zero...
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#16 User is offline   pclayton 

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Posted 2006-September-12, 08:54

Free, on Sep 12 2006, 12:24 AM, said:

Partner had ♠K and ♥Qxx. If you bid 3♥ he'll pass, but 1♥ will be raised. 2♥ is hard to tell. 4♥ is obviously laydown :D

Imo 1♥ is the best bid: you can show the nice hand you have and don't have to take any risk going down doubled in a partscore deal. 200 at MP is a zero...

Frederick, I'm still curious why Pass and then a call is poor tactics? Perhaps Pass and then 3♥ is the best description...

Game is a little lucky; make the ♠K in a minor and it doesn't have much of a play.

Funny hand; it appears the opponents have a cheap sac in 5 of a minor.
"Phil" on BBO
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#17 User is offline   whereagles 

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Posted 2006-September-12, 09:20

pclayton, on Sep 12 2006, 02:54 PM, said:

Funny hand; it appears the opponents have a cheap sac in 5 of a minor.

Which is why you should make it hard for them to bid the minors. The last thing you want is to hear

(1♣) 1/2/3♥ (4m) pass
(5m)

But you'd be allright if it goes

(1♣) 4♥ pass pass
..pass (after a dip into the tank and a sigh)

or

(1♣) 4♥ (4NT) pass
(5m)

because now you can double 5m showing that 4♥ after all was to make, and that you have the playing strength to the 5 level if pard can cooperate with 1-2 tricks.
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#18 User is offline   bid_em_up 

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Posted 2006-September-12, 10:13

whereagles, on Sep 12 2006, 10:20 AM, said:

The last thing you want is to hear

(1♣) 1/2/3♥ (4m) pass
(5m)

ummm, no. The last thing you want to hear is (1♣)-4♥-p-p-X and you are -200/500 against nothing their way.

The 4♥ bidders are making some very strange assumptions in my opinion.

They are assuming that partner has ANY values at all, which is not a good premise. They are also assuming that partners presumed values are also WORKING. The king of diamonds or any club honors (other than the ace) will be totally worthless to you on offense, but may pull some weight on defense as LHO will have limited values as well.

This is not good matchpoint strategy. Bid 1♥, followed by 2♥, partner should realize that you have a good hand to continuing to bid at adverse vul. and raise with a heart fit and a possible trick or two.

As always,

jmoo.
Is the word "pass" not in your vocabulary?
So many experts, not enough X cards.
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#19 User is offline   whereagles 

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Posted 2006-September-12, 10:22

-200/500: I don't think that's likely to happen. If something, opener will bid something. People are quicker to bid than to double when they have points + shape (which opener seems to have).
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#20 User is offline   pclayton 

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Posted 2006-September-12, 10:28

whereagles, on Sep 12 2006, 07:20 AM, said:

pclayton, on Sep 12 2006, 02:54 PM, said:

Funny hand; it appears the opponents have a cheap sac in 5 of a minor.

Which is why you should make it hard for them to bid the minors. The last thing you want is to hear

(1♣) 1/2/3♥ (4m) pass
(5m)

But you'd be allright if it goes

(1♣) 4♥ pass pass
..pass (after a dip into the tank and a sigh)

or

(1♣) 4♥ (4NT) pass
(5m)

because now you can double 5m showing that 4♥ after all was to make, and that you have the playing strength to the 5 level if pard can cooperate with 1-2 tricks.

Most pairs don't have a way to show a long weak minor opposite a strong club (after an intervening pass). I expect the auction will start: (1♣) - pass - (1♦) - pass - (2 minor) - ? I can economically introduce hearts and pard will know I have a good hand and can intelligently proceed.

OTOH, if I make an intervening bid, LHO can make a NFB, or even a jump shift and we may get jammed in a minor.
"Phil" on BBO
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