[Chamaco]

Hi all.

I would like to have feedback-proposals for the following sequence in a strong (16+) club system.

The system is not really standard so it might not really be of interest to everyone.
However, if you do have some suggestions (besides "Don't play this crap!" LOL), I will really appreciate it !

I did not include the rest of the system in order to avoid being too "boring" but if you feel a critical piece of info is missing, I'll be glad to add it. :-)

Thanks !

Mauro

===============================================

1. Note: 1C opening is 16+ and excludes 17-20 4441s a s well as 4 losers 2 suiters (usually 16-18 hcp 55s)

2. We play control responses (in uncontested auctions)

3. The question revolves around this sequence

1C:2D

2D is a "Multi"= a weak 2 (say 3-6 hcp with a 6cM) in a major OR AN UNBALANCED HAND (no 5m332) WITH EXACTLY 5 controls WITHOUT a 4 card major

After 2D, responses by opener are similar as if responder had opened a 2D Multi:

2H/S = Paradox (Pass/correct if responder is weak)
2NT = strong relay

Now, I have toyed with some ideas of how to respond, but I am still quite confused about the best way to show responder's shape when he has the strong hand (5 controls) without majors, especially when opener relays with 2NT.

NOTE: I would like to keep this structure as similar as possible to the following one:

1C:1NT (4 controls, unbal)
2C(relay):2D (no 4+ card major)
.....
Thanks everyone !!

Mauro

[Cascade]

Is that no five-card minor?

How about show a singleton in the unbalanced hand

3♣ Black singleton

3♦ Red singleton

3♥/♠ 6-card major

3NT no singleton

[Chamaco]

Cascade, on Mar 17 2006, 10:01 AM, said:

Is that no five-card minor?

How about show a singleton in the unbalanced hand

3♣ Black singleton

3♦ Red singleton

3♥/♠ 6-card major

3NT no singleton

If responder is strong (5 controls, no 4 major), he may have any of the following:

54 in minors, 31 in majors
54 in minors, 22 in majors
55, 65, 66 minors
6 minor, 332
6 minor, 331
64, 74, 84 minor
7+ minor, one suiter

etc etc :-)

Not sure that simply showing singletons is the most efficient development, at first sight I am thinking that extreme shapes (one/two-suiters) should be shown, but again, my ideas are not quite clear on this topic.

[csdenmark]

How about as Bocchi-Duboin?

2♥♥=Pass/correct
2♥♥-2NT=Strong

They use that structure for Multi 2♦ as weak 6+MAJOR or 20-22HcP,bal

[Chamaco]

csdenmark, on Mar 17 2006, 10:30 AM, said:

How about as Bocchi-Duboin?

2♥♥=Pass/correct
2♥♥-2NT=Strong

They use that structure for Multi 2♦ as weak 6+MAJOR or 20-22HcP,bal

At first I had used the following structure:

1C:2D:2H/S (Paradox)
..... Pass/2S = weak hand, natural
..... 2NT = 54/45 in minors
..... 3m = natural one suiter, not selfsufficient
..... 3M = very good weak 2
..... 3NT = 55 or better in minors
..... 4m = natural, selfsufficient suit, slam try one suiter, first step by opener dislikes the suit, other steps are RKCB responses.

1C:2D:2NT
..... 3C = natural one suiter, OR 54/45 in minors
..... 3D = natural one suiter, not selfsufficient
..... 3M = weak 2, nat
..... 3NT = 55 or better in minors
..... 4m = natural, selfsufficient suit, slam try one suiter, first step by opener dislikes the suit, other steps are RKCB responses.



This is not very sophisticated - to put it mildly - so I was wondering if anyone could come up with a different solution

[csdenmark]

strong hand (5 controls) without majors, especially when opener relays with 2NT
Mauro - the strong option is probably a borderline slam. You need to know whether this or that. Only opps. are interested to know anything about the holdings from opener.

Over the strong response: You need to conduct some asking. As you have no interference it is likely you have a major fit 5-3. You need to know at least whether 5 CTRL is 11 or 13 with queen ask. You need to ask 3card stayman. You need to ask shortness.

Over the preemptive response you only need to know length, maybe min/MAX.


2♥=Pass/correct
2♥-2♠=Signoff
2♥-2NT=Strong
2♠=GF,any
2♠-2NT=5 CTRL. Now asking
2NT=Invite
2♠/2NT-3♣♦=6cd
2♠/2NT-3♥♠=7cd
2NT-3NT=Strong

[keylime]

To me, if responder owns five controls opposite a strong club, you're already in a slam going auction.

Thusly, you need to have clear rules:

1. 4NT is a stopping point, not keycard.
2. Over 1C-2D-2M-2NT, as a strong club what is important to me is your general shape. I propose something like this

3C - stiff heart, any 5-4 minors
3D - stiff spade, any 5-4 minors
3H - single suited club hand
3S - single suited diamond hand
3NT - any semibalanced 5-4 minor hand
4C/D - maybe your 6-4's Smolen style go into here (a la 4C = x-x-6-4, 4D = x-x-4-6; now 4 of the equivalent shape suit (C=H, D=S) sets trumps and is slammish while 4NT can be either a double fit/where are we going?/void in a major somewhere bid)

Since the strong club bidder's shape is still unknown, best to use responder to steer pard into those 5-3 major fits and to those rarified five of a minor games.

[Chamaco]

keylime, on Mar 17 2006, 11:49 PM, said:

To me, if responder owns five controls opposite a strong club, you're already in a slam going auction.

Thusly, you need to have clear rules:

1. 4NT is a stopping point, not keycard.
2. Over 1C-2D-2M-2NT, as a strong club what is important to me is your general shape. I propose something like this

....
....
....
Since the strong club bidder's shape is still unknown, best to use responder to steer pard into those 5-3 major fits and to those rarified five of a minor games.

Ty very much keylime

I would also like to know if you have any suggestions for the best structure in the sequence:
1C:2D:2NT

[keylime]

1C-2D-2NT; I'd use 2NT as an art. asking bid and forcing to game. Basically responses should be something like this:

3C - hearts
3D - spades
3H - stiff heart, any 5-4 minors
3S - stiff spade, any 5-4 minors
3NT - any single suited slam try in a minor
4C/D - minor smolen, your 4-6's

Over the 3C/3D structure, it might be easier for the sake of captain/crew to have opener accept the major as a forcing call, with the inbetween step as an artificial invite to four of a major (with 4D/H -> H/S to accept game try and no more, with bids in between to show max's with cues).