[Jboling]

Anyone heard of or played such a convention? Opening 2♣ with two alternatives,
a. balanced hand with 17-18 points (could also be 18-19 or 19-20, whatever fits best into your system)
b. weak 5-5 two-suiter, major+other

It seems to work, the responses are
pass = weak, (4)5+♣
2♦ = all hands that does not fit into other bids. Opener bids cheaper major with a 5-5 and 2NT with a balanced hand. Opener may user higher bids to show 6-5 or better, 2♦ usually includes some strength (about 7-14)
2♥/♠ = to play, against both handtypes
2NT = asking, GF, normal Wilkosz responses (3NT free for balanced alternative)
3♣ = invitational three-suiter, short spades
higher = as in Wilkosz, not sure if one should use 4-level bids.

2♣-2♦-2♥-?
2♠ = pass or correct
higher = natural, should probably be invitationally oriented. Could probably develop some paradox-like stuff.

2♣-2♦-2[NT]-?
3♣ = Stayman
3♦ = to play, all other rebids are natural GF

It has a lot common with standard multi, so maybe multi-Wilkosz could be allowed where multi is allowed?

It could be used even in a natural system, all you need is to use 2♦ as strong.

[glen]

Interesting. 2♦ could also be Multi, and handle strong hand types.

Would prefer to restrict the weak hand types, so that 2♣ shows 18-19 bal or two suiter with ♠s and another suit. Then:

Pass: to play
2♦ transfer to ♥s - 2♠ now shows ♠s and a minor
2♥ transfers to ♠s - 2♠ or 2NT shows bal, 3X shows two suiter
2♠ pass or correct - pass with two suiter, bid 2NT if bal and now system on
2NT strong ask
3♣ pass or correct with two suiter, bid 3NT if bal without 4/5♥s, 3♠ if bal and 4/5♥s
3♦ with long suit, to play
etc.

[hrothgar]

Ice Relay used a 2♣ opening showing either

weak 2♦ opening OR
5+ Spades and 4+ Hearts (weak) OR
23-24 HCP balanced

[DrTodd13]

Purple Twos

Only 3 meanings for 2♣? How puny. Check out the above link.

[Free]

hrothgar, on Mar 12 2006, 12:51 AM, said:

Ice Relay used a 2♣ opening showing either

weak 2♦ opening OR
5+ Spades and 4+ Hearts (weak) OR
23-24 HCP balanced

I've played that for a while, but it's brown sticker, not allowed for 'sure'...

Dunno what you'd like to play with 2M, but if you really want to play all 2-suiters with strong options included, following is played a lot around here:
2♣ = weak with both Majors (44+, 54+, 55+, whatever you like in current vulnerability) OR semi GF OR NT 22-23
2♦ = weak with 1 Major OR GF any suit OR NT 24+
2M = weak with 5M and 4+m (Muiderberg), which is usually 55+ when V
2NT = 20-21

It works ok, but strong 3-suiters are still a problem. You obviously don't have the control like other strong openings, but they seldom come up and you have a pretty frequent 2-level opening structure.

[Blofeld]

Free, on Mar 12 2006, 03:18 AM, said:

hrothgar, on Mar 12 2006, 12:51 AM, said:

Ice Relay used a 2♣ opening showing either

weak 2♦ opening OR
5+ Spades and 4+ Hearts (weak) OR
23-24 HCP balanced

I've played that for a while, but it's brown sticker, not allowed for 'sure'...

Interesting, it's allowed in the EBU (so long as your strength for both the weak options is about the same) as all of the weak options deny the suit opened.

[Sigi_BC84]

Free, on Mar 12 2006, 09:18 AM, said:

2♦ = weak with 1 Major OR GF any suit OR NT 24+

It works ok, but strong 3-suiters are still a problem. You obviously don't have the control like other strong openings, but they seldom come up and you have a pretty frequent 2-level opening structure.

Why not include the strong 3-suiters into the multi as well? Did I miss something here?

--Sigi

[DrTodd13]

Purple Twos does multiplex the strong 4441's in with 2♣. Quit stealing my ideas man.

[civill]

Very good ideas, but IMO, both weak two and strong two opening without clear forcing requests will transfer hard response problem to PD.

[Jboling]

Forgot to mention that 2♣-2♦ should probably be almost forcing. 2♦ is limited by the inability to bid the gameforcing 2NT, but it can be used for checking if pard has the right major, and then deciding if an invitation should be done. So it is probably quite safe for opener to pass if he intends to decline all invitations, and if he has diamonds of course.

[Sigi_BC84]

DrTodd13, on Mar 13 2006, 12:48 AM, said:

Purple Twos does multiplex the strong 4441's in with 2♣. Quit stealing my ideas man.

:-)

Having a strong-three suiter in the Multi is a very common, if not standard, treatment (at least in my club, if not in most of Germany, if not in most of Europe).

--Sigi

[Gerben42]

Quote

Having a strong-three suiter in the Multi is a very common, if not standard, treatment (at least in my club, if not in most of Germany, if not in most of Europe).

I've seen it before but it seems far from standard. For me a "standard" Multi shows either:
♣ (strong)
♦ (strong)
♥ (weak)
♠ (weak)
or
NT (strong)

[Trinidad]

Gerben42, on Mar 14 2006, 06:37 AM, said:

Quote

Having a strong-three suiter in the Multi is a very common, if not standard, treatment (at least in my club, if not in most of Germany, if not in most of Europe).

I've seen it before but it seems far from standard. For me a "standard" Multi shows either:
♣ (strong)
♦ (strong)
♥ (weak)
♠ (weak)
or
NT (strong)

Well, Gerben, the difference with your "standard Multi" is very small:

This one shows either:
♣ (strong) -> OUT
♦ (strong) -> OUT
♥ (weak) (+ side suit)
♠ (weak) (+ side suit)
or
NT (strong)

I think it shouldn't be a problem at all (but I know it is a problem since the people in power have ruled Wilkosz as Brown Sticker and Multi as an exception).

Rik