[HeartA]

Scoring: IMP

East passed as dealer and bidding went:
(P) - 1H - (P) - 1NT
(P) - 4H - ppp

---

Who is responsible for the missing slam?

[Al_U_Card]

Since I like a 3D J/S from south, he gets my vote.

[cherdano]

South, 4H doesn't show this hand.

Btw, while this would be an easy 2♣ opening playing Chris Ryall's paradox responses, I am not sure this would make finding slam much easier. In standard 2/1, after opener jump rebids 3♦, North can force to slam via 6-KCB (I am imagining 1♥-1N-3♦-4♦-4♥-4N). After 2♣-2♦-2♥-3♥, opener needs a little courage to make a slam try with 4♦, since he has little extras in reserve. I think he should, but I can't claim for sure I would at the table.

[mike777]

4H seems clear cut. Is not 18-20 hcp with self sufficient heart suit standard anymore?


I bid 4s ace ask now, we have a giant hand for partner. I do not worry about clubs. If not playing kickback then cuebid 4s now.

Agree responder should start with constructive 2h and not 1nt...

[pbleighton]

This is kind of tough, neither is totally to blame or entirely off the hook.

3D is better than 4H, but not by much. I might have bid 4H at the table.

After 4H, North has an ace more than minimum. Show the hand by bidding 4S. Then 5C-5D-6H in the magical kingdom of double dummy bidding.

If my teammates did this auction, I would be somewhat disappointed but not too much - on some days I would do it too.

Peter

[Fluffy]

Another perfect hand for forcing 2NT rebid

[mikeh]

The fault lies in the 4♥ rebid, but whether and where blame attaches depends on the partnership agreements or lack thereof.

While the post does not ask for pet methods, I cannot resist a plug for one of mine: use the jumpshift to 3♣, after 1N, as either natural with ♣ or huge with ♥: a hand almost worth 2♣ as an opening bid.

The usual response is 3♦ as a relay, but 3♥ is permissible to show a balanced limit raise (the reason for the 1N bid). This start would get the partnership to slam very easily.

As with all methods, there is a cost: the loss of a natural 3♦ bid is the clearest, but one rarely ends up in ♦ if S has a rounded two-suiter gf or a ♥ monster. Sometimes a natural 3♦ facilitates reaching 3N. These costs are acceptable (to me) in exchange for the enhanced ability to show monster hands while preserving bidding space.

[awm]

I blame the methods. How easy is this hand after north makes a (natural and non-game forcing) 2♦ response?

[mcphee]

Not knowing what they play makes pointing the finger more difficult.

As a passed hand I hate the 1NT bid which seems off base to me. Even a simple 2H raise gives the pair a very good chance to reach 6 H. Drury would have also let 6 H be reached.

4H was not great and I prefer the 3 card J/S which would surely give the partnership an opportunity to reach 6.

If E were to raise H rather than bid 1NT I think sensible biddindg would allow you to reach 6 without much struggle. I make it 60 E 40 W (failure to j/s).

[pbleighton]

"If E were to raise H rather than bid 1NT I think sensible biddindg would allow you to reach 6 without much struggle."

I think they were playing 2/1, and planned a jump raise in hearts. A raise to 2H is an underbid.

Peter

[Stephen Tu]

Quote

4H seems clear cut. Is not 18-20 hcp with self sufficient heart suit standard anymore

This hasn't been the standard for many decades. 1h-1nt-4h = "I have a freak with 7+ hearts, that I thought was a little too strong to just open 4h". The 18-20 hand you describe is in standard methods a jump shift into a fragment then rebid 4h.

[mike777]

Stephen Tu, on Jan 10 2006, 05:01 PM, said:

Quote

4H seems clear cut. Is not 18-20 hcp with self sufficient heart suit standard anymore

This hasn't been the standard for many decades. 1h-1nt-4h = "I have a freak with 7+ hearts, that I thought was a little too strong to just open 4h". The 18-20 hand you describe is in standard methods a jump shift into a fragment then rebid 4h.

Well someone at this table thought it still was, just as I did .

[P_Marlowe]

Hi,

I agree with those, who blame the methods,
4H is what you want to play.
If you want to go sientific, you could bid
3D, which is game forcing, usually showing
a 4 card suit, but a 3 card is possible.

After the 3D you will find the slam, but maybe,
they will find the killing lead, in the cases when
partner holds 4-7 and 3 card support.

With kind regards
Marlowe

[kenrexford]

The partnership, for lacking techniques.

Apparently, 1NT is forcing. Otherwise, why not simly raise hearts?

Assuming this, is not 2H constructive? If so, 1H-P-2H starts an auction allowing some variety of cuebidding, at a low level, to reach slam.

If 2H is not constructive, and 1NT forcing, then my personal vote is for the forcing 2NT rebid (GF). Responder rejects the semi-forced relay to 3C by raising heart immediately. Not fast arrival (4H), but 3H to show extra stuff, and voila! Some other technique is OK.

If 1NT is standard (non-forcing), then why not 3H (presumably limit), 2D, or at least a simple 2H (QJ tight downgraded)?

[inquiry]

cherdano, on Jan 10 2006, 03:41 PM, said:

South, 4H doesn't show this hand.

Btw, while this would be an easy 2♣ opening playing Chris Ryall's paradox responses, I am not sure this would make finding slam much easier. In standard 2/1, after opener jump rebids 3♦, North can force to slam via 6-KCB (I am imagining 1♥-1N-3♦-4♦-4♥-4N). After 2♣-2♦-2♥-3♥, opener needs a little courage to make a slam try with 4♦, since he has little extras in reserve. I think he should, but I can't claim for sure I would at the table.

I don't like the 1NT response. Direct raise by north seems right to me.

As for cherdano's comment, yes this is a great hand for Chris Ryal's paradox response based 2C opener. TI am more optomistic that using Chris;s methods this will get to slam more often than not as after 2H rebid by opener, north will show diamonds, then support hearts.

[Kalvan14]

I play Paradox over a strong 2C, so we would have got to slam that way.

Going back to the posted auction, there is something unclear: the only reason for N not to support immediately hearts (either constructive or limit) is if they play 1NT forcing (and this hand would be shown by a delayed JR).
In such a case, S should avoid bidding 4♥ (3♦ describes the hand much better); again, if 4♥ shows a 18-20 with a self-standing heart suit, N should find the courage to bid again (but I believe he understood 4♥ as a weaker hand).

1♥-1N-3♦-4♦-4♥-4♠-4N-5♥(2 KC)-6♥ should be a reasonable auction.

[EricK]

These are not my methods at all so I may be talking rubbish, but if North was planning on making a jump raise in ♥ on the second round then surely he worth a move over partners 4♥. After all, he would bid also bid 1NT with hands like ♠QJx ♥x ♦QJxxx ♣Jxxx and his actual hand is at least a couple of tricks better than this.

Eric

[cherdano]

EricK, on Jan 11 2006, 07:26 AM, said:

These are not my methods at all so I may be talking rubbish, but if North was planning on making a jump raise in ♥ on the second round then surely he worth a move over partners 4♥. After all, he would bid also bid 1NT with hands like ♠QJx ♥x ♦QJxxx ♣Jxxx and his actual hand is at least a couple of tricks better than this.

Eric

It really depends on what 4♥ shows. For me it shows a 7+-card suit and just about opening strength in highcards. Could be ♠KJx ♥KQJxxxx ♦x ♣Ax, where 5♥ is too high; admittedly, that would be unlucky, but opener certainly won't have 3 keycards, ♥Q AND another king which you need for slam.

Btw, playing 2/1, I might just make a constructive raise to 2♥ with the given hand.

[P_Marlowe]

EricK, on Jan 11 2006, 12:26 AM, said:

These are not my methods at all so I may be talking rubbish, but if North was planning on making a jump raise in ♥ on the second round then surely he worth a move over partners 4♥. After all, he would bid also bid 1NT with hands like ♠QJx ♥x ♦QJxxx ♣Jxxx and his actual hand is at least a couple of tricks better than this.

Eric

Hi,

the hand is better, because the diamond
values fit, if they would not fit, the hand
gets a lot worse, and the 5 level may not
be safe, ... making the contract could be 50%.

But responder has no way to know, what is the
case, so if opener bids 4H, responder has to guess,
he did guess wrong, so be it.

With kind regards
Marlowe

[Gerben42]

Depends on the methods. Let's see:

2/1: North for not making a constructive raise to 2♥
SEF / std. American: North for not raising ♥
Acol: South for not opening 2♣