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Fast arrival

#1 User is offline   oldem 

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Posted 2016-April-23, 05:11

Just a few days ago, we had an interesting board.

I was West. When I heard partner' response of 2 to my 1 opening, showing 10+ HCPs and a biddable suit, I knew we must have game. When I showed my second suit by bidding 2, partner jumped straight to 4, FAST ARRIVAL, showing an opening value in support of , my only problem was to check for Aces. Therefore, when I heard the response of 5 to my Blackwood 4NT, showing 1 ace, I went straight to 6.
Well, I thought the above should have been a routine bidding sequence. But to my surprise, there were 16 tables, but only 2 reached 6. We were second top, since we had to yield a trick to the A at the very opening lead!
As the cards lie, without a opening lead, we can make 13 tricks. The top pair had such luck to make 13 tricks thanks to a opening lead!!!
I was curious to see how such opening lead could have been made. And, to my second surprise, their bidding sequence was even more of a FAST ARRIVAL: they did not give their opponents a chance to interfere by the following.

My third surprise is East's response of 3NT, and my fourth surprise is West's straight jump to 6.
For your information, there were 7 other 4 contracts (2 making 7, 4 making 6, and 1 making 4), 3 3NT contracts (2 making 4, 1 set by down 2), and 1 6NTx (down 2), 1 3 contract (making 6), 2 3 contracts (1 making 5, 1 making 4).
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#2 User is offline   wank 

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Posted 2016-April-23, 14:34

most people on bbo are very bad and often cheating like troopers. there's no point looking at results from other random tables. 1s-3nt-6h is entirely ridiculous.
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#3 User is offline   ggwhiz 

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Posted 2016-April-23, 16:14

A much more common failing is after a help suit game try.

ie. 1 - 2
3 asking for help

I've seen lots just jump to game with club help and a red ace that they should cue at no cost.
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#4 User is offline   msjennifer 

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Posted 2016-April-24, 01:31

3NT by East is a silly ,if not idiotic ,bid on Easts hand.It can come only from a person who wants to play the hand himself..Playing A standard system one must start with 2 Clubs which allows partner to describe his hand to a T.I can not agree with the 3 NT response even when playing Precision,wherein 1S shows not more than 15 HCP.The 3 NT bid must have infuriated West who bid 6 Heart to teach a lesson to East.Of course East could have continued idiotically by bidding 6 NT ,which he later could have said " partner I was trying for a Top".As George Coffin would have said,"Morons like East do exist!".Just by the way ,the correct response playing Wei's Precision system on Easts hand is a forcing bid of just 1 NT.
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#5 User is offline   mgoetze 

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Posted 2016-April-24, 02:58

View Postoldem, on 2016-April-23, 05:11, said:

response of 2 to my 1 opening, showing 10+ HCPs [...] jumped straight to 4, FAST ARRIVAL

Wait, what? Why is this a fast arrival bid? Was 2 nonforcing? Would 3 instead of 4 have been forcing? This makes no sense to me.
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#6 User is offline   oldem 

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Posted 2016-April-24, 04:04

View Postmgoetze, on 2016-April-24, 02:58, said:

Wait, what? Why is this a fast arrival bid? Was 2 nonforcing? Would 3 instead of 4 have been forcing? This makes no sense to me.

If that makes no sense to you, then just forget about it! Remember I already wrote there were 7 other 4 contracts, some of them followed your line of bidding, and then, died off at 4! You think that 3 is forcing, but it seems that many other only think it as invitational.
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#7 User is offline   1eyedjack 

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Posted 2016-April-24, 04:21

I think his point is that 4H is only a "fast arrival" bid *IF* 3H is forcing. How others were treating it at other tables is not relevant. The only point of relevance is what 3H would have meant at your table.

For many partnerships the initial 2C response would have been GF. If 2C had been GF, then 3H would have been forcing and 4H might then be fast arrival (not that I agree that it is sensible, but that is an argument for another day).

However you have already stated that in your methods 2C simply shows 10+ points and biddable Clubs. At the minimum end of the scale that is not enough to GF, and it is reasonable in that context for 3H to be invitational and non-forcing. Again in that context, 4H might reasonably show extras, in which case it would not be a fast arrival bid.

Hope that clarifies why he was confused.
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Masterminding (pron. mPosted ImagesPosted ImagetPosted Imager-mPosted ImagendPosted Imageing) tr. v. - Any bid made by bridge player with which partner disagrees.

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#8 User is offline   fourdad 

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Posted 2016-April-24, 04:53

I am confused over the discussion of 3H. 3H was not bid was it?
If 2C is 10+....meaning they are not playing 2/1, then 2H is non forcing showing 5-4 in the majors.

If W bids 3H, which I agree is the better bid, that is forcing showing 16+...once partner goes 4H, then W hand increases in value and slam controls are investigated.

Doesn't the slam depend on the KS? It could just as easily be in the N hand true?
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#9 User is offline   Tramticket 

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Posted 2016-April-24, 06:50

What do you bid with 4-card heart support and a 10-count. Are you really passing? Partner's bid is wide-range. So for me a raise to 3 hearts is invitational and it follows that 4H is NOT Fast Arrival.
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#10 User is offline   wank 

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Posted 2016-April-24, 17:17

1) 2h would be forcing in any system
2) yes, 4h is fast arrival - you bid 4th suit then 4H as a stronger 4H bid
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#11 User is offline   Zelandakh 

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Posted 2016-April-24, 18:55

View Postoldem, on 2016-April-23, 05:11, said:

And, to my second surprise, their bidding sequence was even more of a FAST ARRIVAL: they did not give their opponents a chance to interfere

South had an excellent chance to interfere at their first turn. It is really quite remarkable that South only opened at 3 of the 16 tables and North only raised at one of those. At 2 of the 3 tables where South opened 2, E-W had a disaster (3+3 and 6NTX-2). 4 seems like a completely normal result for a BBO room. To the OP, would you still have launched Blackwood without the overcall?
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