[jillybean]

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Bid this with me. I'll force you to make a Jacoby 2nt raise, we can discuss the spade suit later.

[apollo1201]

 jillybean, on 2026-September-03, 09:56, said:

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Bid this with me. I'll force you to make a Jacoby 2nt raise, we can discuss the spade suit later.

I will not be very useful as I do not masterize the follow ups. I am puzzled by showing shortage, nothing more, and then responder has to guess wether to go for slam or not facing an opener that can have anything from 11 to 19. Responder also can start at 12-13.

I am also unsure whether hiding such an importance source of tricks was wise.

Anyway, if 4D just means a control and is not a strong commitment to go higher should partner control clubs, it is probably a good bid. If 4D virtually launches BW when partner controls clubs, it coup be an overbid.

But with 9 trumps at least and a suit that will often generate 4 discards after being ruffed, we could make. 7 minor from partner, one trick lost to opps (a D for instance), 1 cashing (the CA for instance), 1 D trumped in my hand (we might need to pull 3 rounds) and 4 discarded.

x
KQxxx
xxx
Axxx

makes even on a C lead (CA, SA, S ruff, 3 rounds of trumps ending in dummy, then 3 clubs and 1 D discarded) and is not an opening. Barring bad breaks of course.

So we shouldnt close the bidding.

Of course partner can have different hands with wasted D honors and weaker trumps.

Maybe bidding our S then splintering in D would take the message across?

[pescetom]

 jillybean, on 2026-September-03, 09:56, said:

Bid this with me. I'll force you to make a Jacoby 2nt raise, we can discuss the spade suit later.

I am more lunar influenced that most, but unless you alert and (really) explain 2NT I am at a loss

In my own agreements it will not surprise you that I have an automatic 2♣ response which forces game and does not guarantee clubs or deny hearts fit or both majors.

[mike777]

Very confusing options
J2NT for me
Hard to stop short of 6 but over 2NT tell me minimum (3C) or non minimum with shortness(3D)..or other..

If you have a minimum with short spades, probably end up in 6H after RKC

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If only permitted one bid then 6H

[jillybean]

Old fashioned responses to Jacoby 2nt - 3♠ says I am short in spades, silent as to strength

[akwoo]

I'm bidding 4♦, first or second round control. We're odds on for slam opposite x KQxxx xxxx AKxx - a good minimum, but a minimum. Your hand is very good - you're odds on for 5 spade tricks despite partner's spade shortness.

I've never played serious/non-serious, so I don't have a good sense of whether this is worth a serious 4♦ rather than non-serious 3N - it might be a partnership discussion.

[mikeh]

You couldn’t pay me…ok, if you paid me a lot then you could pay me…to bid 2N. Wtf is the hurry to take control, especially if playing old fashioned J2N. Here I am at the 3 level with no idea whether we can make a grand, a small or just a game in hearts. Nice methods.*

Anyway, maybe I’m playing pro with a client unfamiliar with modern bidding methods. I’ll bid 3N. I assume partner isn’t so hopeless as to think I want to play 3N. Now I’ll find out whether partner has a club control, over which I should probably bid keycard since almost certainly partner won’t help me out over 4D by me. May as well continue the grabbing of control of this auction (aka masterminding) tyat I began with my fatuous 2N.

* if we don’t play 2 way new minor I could (barely) accept 2N since after 1H 1S 1N we may have issues.

[a_user]

Assuming normal club level players, why not 4♦ splinter 1st.
Doesn't Jacoby 2NT suggest a balanced hand with 4 ♥?

[jillybean]

Partner does show a club control and shows 2, no Q when asked for key cards

[mike777]

 a_user, on 2026-September-03, 22:31, said:

Assuming normal club level players, why not 4♦ splinter 1st.
Doesn't Jacoby 2NT suggest a balanced hand with 4 ♥?

No and no

Splinters are much weaker, minimum gf type hands, this hand is much too strong

J2NT does not promise or suggest a balanced hand..

[Cyberyeti]

This is why I play 2♠ SJS, we get the same info in our auction 1♥-2♠-2N (less than stiff Q♠) 4 bids lower

2N is horrible with the likely 3♠ response, over our 2N we bid length, so is not as bad

[jillybean]

2S SJS would be ideal, but we can't provide all treatments on our CC, and some are simply not available to certain partnerships.
We've got to do the best we can with what we have.

What is your bid after 2N (less than stiff Q♠) and what is your J2nt system.