[mike777]

---

Low spade lead

Opp silent


4H by south


I just made a complete mess of this....

what is the best line here, what should my thinking be at trick one


I just felt as if I messed up at trick one but definitely I felt I was a disaster at trick two, then my play only got worse...



the good news was I actually played pretty well in the rest of the match, we won

My first hand diagram hope I got it right
ty JB

[pescetom]

I doubt you should torture yourself for this, well done for the win.

FWIW I imagine that at the table I would have taken with Ace, run a diamonds to Ace (planning to finesse next time) and then played off the spades hoping West wins.

[steve2005]

pescetom, on 2026-August-29, 14:43, said:

I doubt you should torture yourself for this, well done for the win.

FWIW I imagine that at the table I would have taken with Ace, run a diamonds to Ace (planning to finesse next time) and then played off the spades hoping West wins.

that line asks to get ruffed in diamonds

i would win AS
lead trump towards KQ
if it holds go back to dummy with club and lead another heart

if Ace pops you have 10 tricks unless ace singleton and probably even then

well done winning match agreed

[mikeh]

Short term thinking has one winning and playing three rounds of clubs to pitch a spade. That’s very short sighted. Wtf are you going to do next, even assuming that the clubs stand up. You still have trump and diamond issues even if the club Jack drops. Bear in mind that if the hand with the heart Ace has the fourth club, the other defender gets a ruff. Meanwhile, you’ve eliminated an entry to dummy to play on hearts.

My idea is to win and play a heart to the King. If the heart ace is onside, I think I’m cold on a 3-2 trump break. I’m not down yet if the heart ace is offside, though I won’t be able to handle 4-1 trump very often.

As for the minors, I’m hoping to be able to get some kind of inferential count and then decide to play for a diamond hook or a minor suit squeeze, or the club Jack dropping. I like my chances but not if I don’t stop to THINK at trick one.

[mike777]

I did think about the hand before trick one, however I only got as far as what if they duck the KH at trick two.


What do I do?

Do I continue hearts out of my hand? Do I cross to the KC and lead another H or something else at trick 3?

Anyway I blew a fuse and right after I did something else at trick two, I knew that was wrong. In fact right at the table, I thought perhaps my play at trick one was not best...It quickly went downhill from there...



At the other table West did not duck the H and that was that....

[Kaitlyn S]

mikeh, on 2026-August-29, 15:24, said:

Short term thinking has one winning and playing three rounds of clubs to pitch a spade. That's very short sighted. Wtf are you going to do next, even assuming that the clubs stand up. You still have trump and diamond issues even if the club Jack drops. Bear in mind that if the hand with the heart Ace has the fourth club, the other defender gets a ruff. Meanwhile, you've eliminated an entry to dummy to play on hearts.

My idea is to win and play a heart to the King. If the heart ace is onside, I think I'm cold on a 3-2 trump break. I'm not down yet if the heart ace is offside, though I won't be able to handle 4-1 trump very often.

As for the minors, I'm hoping to be able to get some kind of inferential count and then decide to play for a diamond hook or a minor suit squeeze, or the club Jack dropping. I like my chances but not if I don't stop to THINK at trick one.

Why is it shortsighted to play three clubs? If I can lose two hearts and a diamond, I make the contract. Clubs split more than half the time, and if they get a ruff with the fourth club, much of the time it is going to be with a natural trump trick. If clubs are 5-2, they are very likely to be trumping with a natural trump trick. Or at least a trick they were getting anyway because I'm leading hearts from hand. If I pick up diamonds, I make the hand with this line even if hearts are 4-1. I think that not losing a spade is huge in enhancing your chances.

[mikeh]

Kaitlyn S, on 2026-August-29, 17:21, said:

Why is it shortsighted to play three clubs? If I can lose two hearts and a diamond, I make the contract. Clubs split more than half the time, and if they get a ruff with the fourth club, much of the time it is going to be with a natural trump trick. If clubs are 5-2, they are very likely to be trumping with a natural trump trick. Or at least a trick they were getting anyway because I'm leading hearts from hand. If I pick up diamonds, I make the hand with this line even if hearts are 4-1. I think that not losing a spade is huge in enhancing your chances.

I think it’s close and I don’t pretend to be able to work out the percentages. The major problems are that if you olay three rounds of clubs to pitch a spade, about 37% of the time they get an immediate ruff. It could be with a natural trump trick but not always. Suppose the clubs holdup…your only entry to dummy is now a spade ruff, so your choices on how to play the red suits are seriously constrained. If you lead trump,from hand you’re conceding 2 trump losers on any 3-2 break, whereas if you ignore the spade pitch you hold your trump losers to one any time the suit is 3-2 with the ace onside, which is a little over 34%, hardly trivial. Plus if you take your pitch, and ruff a spade to play trump from dummy, not only do you risk a club ruff from the short heart holding but you still lose two trump tricks to Ace third onside since you can’t get back to dummy. Ace doubleton onside is about 20%, so much worse than playing for Ace third.

Finally, you still have a diamond issue, which isn’t solved by the club Jack dropping which is more than 25%. My line avoids a diamond guess more than 25% of the time.

Throw all,of these factors,and other improbable elements I’ve omitted because they are low frequency and would require far more time than I’m prepared to spend, and my gut sense is that playing for the immediate pitch is a losing line more often than not. Of course, inferior lines sometimes work, which is why the game s so interesting. If the best lines always worked, not body would play.

[WasWinM]

The best way to begin a suit contract hand is to count losers before playing a card, then formulate a plan. This hand has two or even three potential losing hearts a spade loser and a potential diamond loser.
Not too much can be done if the AJ10x is over the KQx, so ignore that. We really can't know how to play until we know the heart loser situation. I'm with MikeH on this and my instinct is to fly Ace of spades and lead a heart to the King. One thing this does is hold my losses to 2 hearts if the A is singleton onside and 1 loser if the J10 is doubleton. If the heart king holds, I cross to the club king, and play another heart to the Q. If that loses, after the third heart is played by me or them, I play on clubs. If the jack comes in, I can throw two diamonds on good clubs. If it doesn't I can ruff the fourth club and still fall back on the diamond finesse.

A final problem with using the club to pitch a spade is anytime the club jack does not come in, the hand will come down to NT and the diamond finesse will not only have to be on but the diamonds 3/2 as well. The north hand plays to 3 rounds of hearts and will get forced by two spade ruffs. This on top of having to guess how to play hearts starting from hand: it you play the K and the 10 comes down from RHO, is it J10 doubleton or a false card from j10x to get you to play Q to the now singleton A?

[Kaitlyn S]

WasWinM, on 2026-August-30, 06:54, said:

...Not too much can be done if the AJ10x is over the KQx, so ignore that.

Not so fast! My "shortsighted line" doesn't have a spade loser and if I can avoid a diamond loser (more likely if LHO has four trumps), then I believe I lose three hearts and nothing else. Also note that it doesn't hurt me if the player with AJTx ruffs the third club, I pitch my spade and lose two other trumps.

[WasWinM]

Kaitlyn S, on 2026-August-30, 10:29, said:

Not so fast! My "shortsighted line" doesn't have a spade loser and if I can avoid a diamond loser (more likely if LHO has four trumps), then I believe I lose three hearts and nothing else. Also note that it doesn't hurt me if the player with AJTx ruffs the third club, I pitch my spade and lose two other trumps.

First, I didn't call your line shortsighted. There are a lot of things to consider on this hand, though. If the club J doesn't come in, there is risk. One risk is 5-2 clubs, the third club ruffed while you pitch a spade. If the long club player had the heart Ace, you will suffer an uppercut on the 4th club and lose 3 trumps even if they are 2-2 and the ace onside. Even a 4-3 club break sets up an uppercut.
It really all gets down I think, as I as said first, to the diamond suit. Playing your line you are obligated, against best defense, to have Qxx onside or guess Qx offside. By starting hearts first, you learn how many heart losers you'll have and still have the entry to take the diamond finesse and withstand a 4-1 diamond break with singleton Q offside, being able to test the diamonds first before crossing to the club K.

I think.

edit: yes, playing on hearts is a losing line if the AJ10x is over the KQx. Does a lot better again AJ10x, onside.

[WasWinM]

mike777, on 2026-August-29, 16:50, said:

I did think about the hand before trick one, however I only got as far as what if they duck the KH at trick two.


What do I do?

Cross to the club K and lead another heart. If you end up with two losing hearts, you will be able to shed two losing diamonds on the clubs if the Jack comes down. If not, you can ruff the club for the diamond finesse.

[Kaitlyn S]

WasWinM, on 2026-August-31, 12:41, said:

First, I didn't call your line shortsighted....

I need to be more careful with my quotes. Mike called it shortsighted