[P_Marlowe]

Hi,

a 3C bid instead of the 2D bid, is passable,
at least for me, it is courtesy raise, inv. strength.

For me the 2C rebid, does not promise a 6 card suit,
after all opener may hold a 4 card suit in hearts /
diamonds, and just is to weak to mention the suit.

With kind regards
Marlowe

[whereagles]

Al_U_Card, on Jul 25 2005, 03:58 PM, said:

Since pard has denied a balanced hand, does anyone treat 3C over the 2C as a request for further info, or is it 100% passable?  My pards who open light take this as forcing to 3NT, with 4C the other safe landing space (opener DOES have 6+ clubs for the rebid).

Some people, who don't use 3rd suit forcing, play

1♣ 1♠
2♣ 3♣

as invitational. If opener accepts the invitation, he can bid 3♠ on the way to 3NT, in order to cater for a possible 5-3 spade fit.

[mike777]

Still prefer my jump to 3nt.
1) Kleinman's 3 Queen rule.
2) Long solid major.
3) No stiff or void.
4) Like the lead in 3nt coming up to me, not through me.
5) Need one less trick than 4s and opp seem to mess up defending 3nt more than suit contracts.
6) Jump to 3nt may disguise my hand shape more than jump to 4S
7) Science bids of 2d or 3c may tell the opp more, give them a chance to x for lead, make pard bid 3nt and not me, etc.
8) With all of the above said 4S may still be the winning contract.

[Walddk]

mike777, on Jul 25 2005, 07:15 PM, said:

4) Like the lead in 3nt coming up to me, not through me.

Is it because your holding in diamonds is particularly suited for that, or is it perhaps because you think you're a better declarer than your partner?

x
Axxx
Kx
AKxxxx

Is ♦A always on side for you? If it's not, and you are at least one down in a contract that has about a 75% chance of making on a diamond lead if played by your partner, maybe you think he's impressed when you tell him:

"Sorry, partner, how could I know that I wrong-sided the contract? I liked the lead in 3NT coming up to me, not through me".

Roland

[mike777]

Walddk, on Jul 25 2005, 12:35 PM, said:

mike777, on Jul 25 2005, 07:15 PM, said:

4) Like the lead in 3nt coming up to me, not through me.

Is it because your holding in diamonds is particularly suited for that, or is it perhaps because you think you're a better declarer than your partner?

Roland you must have never seen me play nt before.
If there is a way to go down in NT contracts, I find them.
Here I was hoping Partner was responder and I am opener . Poor usage of pronouns by me.

[Walddk]

mike777, on Jul 24 2005, 05:42 PM, said:

Yes, this hand type is always tough in a natural system.
I would jump to 3nt over 2clubs but...

I just thought you meant what you wrote in a previous post too. How silly I am.

Roland

[Al_U_Card]

P_Marlowe, on Jul 25 2005, 11:12 AM, said:

Hi,

a 3C bid instead of the 2D bid, is passable,
at least for me, it is courtesy raise, inv. strength.

For me the 2C rebid, does not promise a 6 card suit,
after all opener may hold a 4 card suit in hearts /
diamonds, and just is to weak to mention the suit.

With kind regards
Marlowe

Thanks for the succinct reply. That is pretty much my take on the "standard" version of the courtesy raise bid altho in these days of superlight openings, some game going hands need to be supergood......

[han]

When discussed I would bid 2D with this hand, artificial and forcing to game.

When undiscussed I would try my best (with random partner, 2H might be passed, 3S might range from preemptive to slam try, and 3NT seems bad to me), and I would discuss it afterwards.


As an aside:

Roland, why do you say that weak jump shifts imply that the auction 1C-1S-2C-3S is forcing? Do you make a "weak jump shift" with 9 or 10 points, so that 1C-1S-2C-2S is invitational? If you do, that would be playable I think (as long as you don't also do it with hands that I would make a weak jump shift with), but shouldn't you call it something else, perhaps "constructive jump shift"? If not, please enlighten me about this implication.