[whereagles]

3S because pard might be unwilling to go to game on xx of spades if I don't encourage him.

[flytoox]

whereagles, on Jul 17 2005, 05:48 AM, said:

3S because pard might be unwilling to go to game on xx of spades if I don't encourage him.

With xx of spade doesnot give you much chance. The key to this hand is pd's Heart support. Pd's 1N denies 3 card supoort(If he has then he must have a limited raise with three cards), Without heart support you will have at least two losers in heart suit.

[bearmum]

keylime, on Jul 15 2005, 12:00 PM, said:

I like 4H direct. It's a "feel" bid.

I really feel that you don't trust partner's bid BECAUSE
a 4♥ "feel" might not be good because P has bid a forcing 1NT(maybe on a REALLY weak suit that couldn't be bid) ---- IMHO you need to bid 2♥ ( showing 4+♥) --- I KNOW u have 5 of them BUT minimum points and u have NO idea what pard's 1NT is ) then AFTER partner's NEXT bid you can decide if GAME ( or maybe slam?) is on

GUESS IT'S ALL ABOUT BIDDING THE SYSTEM

[the hog]

As an aside, there is a nice structure you can use here which is part of "The Science".

After a 1NT response:
2C = t/f to D
2D = t/f to H
2H = t/f to S
2S = t/f to C

Using these rebids by opener allows a slower better development of the auction eg
1S 1N
2D 2S
3H non forcing

Would show a hand similar to this.

[SoTired]

Hog's transfer rebids are intriguing. Seems great except getting screwed with 5323, rebid 2S, and end in 3C on 7/8-card fit. Is there a link that has the whole structure?

My humble thoughts for normal 2/1:

1) I play 1N shows <12 and probably <3s. That's it. Where in 2/1 does 1S 1N likely deny 4+ hearts? Why is 1S 1N likely a minor 5/5? Did I miss a lecture somewhere?

2) If you bid 3H, that is a GF j/s. Partner with 4 hearts may go slamming expecting you to have more than 1 key card.

3) 3N shows a solid major with 15-17. You have the solid major but this hand is too lite.

4) 2S sells the heart suit out. It also undervalues the hand.

5) 3S also sells the heart suit out. It denies solid spades with 15-17. It's great if partner has some minor suit honors and can scrouge 3 tricks for a successful 3N bid. But that is unlikely. Most likely partner's 3N will be stuck in dummy running the spades. Afterwards leading away from the HJ looking at several unreachable minor tricks in the other hand. Playing 3N on this hand could be ugly or perfect. But after a 3S rebid responder is likely to bid 3N and you will be clueless about which contract is best.

6) This is a MAJOR 6-5 for goodness sakes. Won't you please try a little harder to play in one of the majors?

7) Seems we are left with the obvious rebid of 2H. We have a good answer for every responder action: 3H over 2S thru 3D, 4H over 3H/3S, and pass over 3N (who bids that?). True, responder may pass with the magical ♠x ♥HHx hand. But even that hand fails 4H when they split badly.

Seems the odds and logic highly favor the 2H rebid.

[the hog]

5332 shapes are no problem of course as they are opened in the approriate NT range, or else you have a rebid of an invitational 2NT.

[MickyB]

SoTired, on Jul 18 2005, 07:50 AM, said:

1) I play 1N shows <12 and probably <3s. That's it. Where in 2/1 does 1S 1N likely deny 4+ hearts? Why is 1S 1N likely a minor 5/5? Did I miss a lecture somewhere?

Given your length in the suits, I think partner's most likely shape is 2344...