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What do you overcall?

#1 User is offline   AL78 

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Posted 2024-February-07, 18:10

AKJT9854
T6
75
6

MPs, red against green (again), opps playing 4 card majors weak NT, RHO dealer and opens 1. What do you do?
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#2 User is offline   akwoo 

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Posted 2024-February-07, 18:15

Normally, 4.

But if we're one of the stronger pairs in the room and the opps are not, 1 might work out better.
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#3 User is offline   jillybean 

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Posted 2024-February-07, 19:40

4 for me too.

If I've got an 8 card suit the chances are the opps have distribution too.
I want partner to know I have this hand and I'm happy to play 4 opposite nothing. If needed, he can compete with the right cards.
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#4 User is offline   P_Marlowe 

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Posted 2024-February-08, 00:37

4S looks normal, a tiny bit light, you would prefer to play IMPs.
... So 3S is also a valid option.
With kind regards
Uwe Gebhardt (P_Marlowe)
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#5 User is online   Cyberyeti 

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Posted 2024-February-08, 00:41

View Postjillybean, on 2024-February-07, 19:40, said:

4 for me too.

If I've got an 8 card suit the chances are the opps have distribution too.
I want partner to know I have this hand and I'm happy to play 4 opposite nothing. If needed, he can compete with the right cards.


Agree, might be 500 against a game or 200 against a part score, but if it is, unlucky
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#6 User is offline   AL78 

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Posted 2024-February-08, 02:57

I overcalled 4 and got punished for it:



I can't remember exactly who doubled but I went two down due to my own stupidity, when West got in and led a spade I should not taken the finesse but play AK and hope to drop the offside queen (who is leading a trump from Qxx sat under declarer with a void in dummy?). It didn't matter, one down is still a bottom:

4X N -500
5X E +300
4 W +50
5 W +150

I wondered if due to the vulnerability I should have opened 3.
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#7 User is offline   jillybean 

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Posted 2024-February-08, 06:24

Bad luck

edi; Yes, bad luck West found an uncommon double!
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#8 User is offline   P_Marlowe 

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Posted 2024-February-08, 06:31

View Postjillybean, on 2024-February-08, 06:24, said:

Bad luck

I dont think so, ..., a green game is 420-450, if you go down -2Xed this will be bad.
The bad luck is, that West found the Double, I have no idea, how he found it, he has a min
opener, only 1 quick trick.
So yes it was bad luck in the sense, that you played against this part. West,
but -500 vs. green game is a high risk playing MP.

I would do it as well, but I usually play the same at MP as I play at IMPs, ...
the given situation is one, that asks for a different approach, which I do not employ,
one reason I am not particular good playing MP.

Another thing: the scores are random, and dont have anything to do with the dealt cards,
the only score remotely sane is 4H-1, you get there after a 3S overcall, all other contracts
are due to rolling dices.
With kind regards
Uwe Gebhardt (P_Marlowe)
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#9 User is online   Cyberyeti 

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Posted 2024-February-08, 08:07

How did the play go ?
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#10 User is offline   mikeh 

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Posted 2024-February-08, 10:51

4S is imo completely normal and it’s a sad reflection on the quality of your club that it wasn’t, apparently, bid at any other table.

Cyber’s question is very appropriate. Looking at all four hands I’d expect to make 4S.

On a heart lead, one can see that the contract is likely going down but…if we can score a diamond trick and the spade queen drops, we have 10 tricks. So it’s tempting to pop the ace and lead a club. What’s west to do? If he pops the ace, you can’t go down. If he ducks, then east should workout to cash the diamond ace and down you go.

You can make it more difficult for the defence (bearing in mind that you don’t know there’s a diamond ruff out there but just on general principles, if you duck the heart lead. Now west would need to be clairvoyant to underlead his clubs.

I’d expect to make 4S against all but the very best defenders and probably against the very best defenders at mps. Under leading the club, or ducking on a lead from dummy, is the best way to get a zero as defender…..picture north with the king of clubs…stiff or possibly even Kx….east might (but probably wouldn’t) lead his partner’s suit even with a stiff club.
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#11 User is offline   Gilithin 

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Posted 2024-February-08, 12:31

View Postmikeh, on 2024-February-08, 10:51, said:

4S is imo completely normal and it’s a sad reflection on the quality of your club that it wasn’t, apparently, bid at any other table.

You completely miss the point here Mike. Almost all AL78 threads are about winning the post-mortem. Usually they are about blaming partner but here, with no partner to blame, it is about justifying the action. The same for the other club preempt hand. Sadly, this seems to be the primary content on these forums since Fred left the building. I very much appreciate your still being here trying to offer help and advice but it increasingly feels like it is an uphill battle to get good quality threads here. Other than BW (which I generally dislike) I am not sure what other options remain open to bridge players looking for genuine discussion.

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NB to BBF staff: as usual I could post this comment without quoting Mike but not with the quote. Editing it in does work.
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#12 User is offline   Douglas43 

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Posted 2024-February-08, 15:51

View PostGilithin, on 2024-February-08, 12:31, said:

You completely miss the point here Mike. Almost all AL78 threads are about winning the post-mortem. Usually they are about blaming partner but here, with no partner to blame, it is about justifying the action. The same for the other club preempt hand. Sadly, this seems to be the primary content on these forums since Fred left the building. I very much appreciate your still being here trying to offer help and advice but it increasingly feels like it is an uphill battle to get good quality threads here. Other than BW (which I generally dislike) I am not sure what other options remain open to bridge players looking for genuine discussion.

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NB to BBF staff: as usual I could post this comment without quoting Mike but not with the quote. Editing it in does work.


As AL78 said he went two down through his own stupidity, it seems a bit harsh to say he's trying to win the post-mortem?
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#13 User is offline   nullve 

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Posted 2024-February-08, 17:14

View PostGilithin, on 2024-February-08, 12:31, said:

Almost all AL78 threads are about winning the post-mortem.

Not just almost all, but all of Gilithin's threads are about winning the post-mortem, aren't they? :)
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#14 User is offline   AL78 

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Posted 2024-February-08, 17:25

View PostDouglas43, on 2024-February-08, 15:51, said:



As AL78 said he went two down through his own stupidity, it seems a bit harsh to say he's trying to win the post-mortem?


Gilithin recently seems to have developed a hobby of following me around on this forum and bullying me. Fine, if that is what makes him happy, I can easily ignore. I don't need anyone on this forum or anywhere else for validity.
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#15 User is offline   Gilithin 

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Posted 2024-February-08, 18:47

View Postnullve, on 2024-February-08, 17:14, said:

Not just almost all, but all of Gilithin's threads are about winning the post-mortem, aren't they? :)

I'm not sure I have actually started a thread here yet, so that's probably factually true! :lol:
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#16 User is offline   pescetom 

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Posted 2024-February-11, 17:38

View PostGilithin, on 2024-February-08, 18:47, said:

I'm not sure I have actually started a thread here yet, so that's probably factually true! :lol:

I think that is part of the problem, but only a drop in the ocean of indifference/cowardise/superficiality that can easily kill a discussion forum.
You do have a habit of digging up moribund threads, but I would not interpret that as persecution and it might even be virtuous if you were more timely :)
I rarely disagree with you and would encourage you to speak sooner and expose your own doubts too.
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